Young cat won't 'go' outside reliably

[kcsunshine73]

Our young neutered boy cat (born May 2014, so still quite a kitten) was using the litter tray brilliantly, I moved it from the kitchen in to the utility room and then outside. At first, when I moved it outside, he was going outside fine too. Hhe has cat flaps through from the kitchen where he lives, through to the utility room and then to the outside.
Recently though, he has taken to doing the occasional big wee (and yesterday also a poo) in the utility room outside my washing machine, on the concrete floor. I've been chucking down my non-bio soap powder and mopping it up; tonight I've gone in to find it again and tried putting down some white vinegar after I\d cleaned up.
The litter tray is still where it's been for weeks now, under a hedge, where he's been going, but he's insisting on going inside - I even caught him stopping to go tonight after he'd already been once.
HELP! My husband is not a fan of unclean animal behaviour and is suggesting I bring the try back indoors - to me, this seems like a step backwards, like putting a potty training toddler back into a nappy ... I think he's just being lazy, but am keen to know if there is a way to get him outside more so he doesn't go indoors any more.
My two older cats (9yo neutered boy and 5yo spayed girl) have always gone outside, ever since we moved here and kept them in for the requisite six weeks first. They don't use litter trays and I sure as heck don't want to be using one forever with this little numbskull!

[SarahT1 [PLLE]]

Hello

Is there a particular reason why you don't want to keep a little tray down for your little boy. It sounds as if he doesn't feel safe or comfortable going to the loo outside at the moment. Can you not bring the tray in as your husband suggests until he chooses to start going to the loo outside of his own accord And if he doesn't, then he's like many cats who still prefer to do their business inside where it feels safe. My 3 are different every day. Sometimes the litter trays are barely touched and they go in the garden. Other days they come in from the garden specifically to use the trays. As long as they are happy they can do as they like.

If you are concerned about litter tray smells we have just started using World's Best litter and it's just that! No residual smells at all and it clumps like a dream.

[Crewella]

I agree with Sarah - something could have scared him and he just feels safer going indoors sometimes. Most of mine go outside, but will sometimes use the tray indoors, like Sarah's. Cats feel very vulnerable when they pee/poo, and if there's another animal using the garden then sometimes it could become a territorial issue as well. It's not fair to equate the litter tray with a nappy - it's not someting they should 'grow out of', and you're better off with a litter tray than a stressed cat with litter tray issues. He might stop using the tray as he gets older and more confident outdoors, but don't push him too hard.

[kcsunshine73]

Thanks; we are not really geared up to full time litter tray for ever, I have really been treating it as a temporary measure as I've only ever had to do that with our other two when we've moved house. I don't really have the space for one long term, I see them more as a temporary inconvenience (and it's always me 'dealing' with it!) that I don't want to deal with ad infinitum. He seems to go outside mostly but sometimes he chooses not to bother and has been going in the same spot where I had had the tray in the utility room ... I put down some vinegar and tinfoil last night and am about to get in from work and check he's not tried it since ...

[Kay]

he's not even 6 months old, and far too young to be forced outside if he doesn't feel safe - that outdoor litter tray, which presumably you don't clean out, could be being used by any number of neighbourhood cats

I don't want to be harsh, but I'm afraid dealing with indoor litter trays and their contents is just part of responsible cat ownership in my book - getting the right kind of tray and litter, and attending to it a couple of times a day, is no chore really, and takes just minutes

[SarahT1 [PLLE]]

A litter tray doesn't take up much space, KC, and if your little boy is caught short, it's miserable for him if there is no tray to use. 'Dealing' with a litter tray is just one of those things we do for our babies. We make quite a game of it, commenting to them on the contents! the fact the he goes in the place where the litter tray was shows that it is a spot he felt happy with. It would be lovely for him if you felt able to reconsider your perception of litter tray use. I think it was just luck of the draw that your other two cats are consistent in going to the loo outdoors. Not all cats are the same. Ah well. Take care and fusses to your darling boy.

[sarie]

I don't want to be seen to be having a go as I know you're here for advice and I'd rather that you felt you could take our advice rather than feeling like you need to defend yourself... the advice here is just to try to help
I'd like to second what's already been said though... at his age he shouldn't even really be going outside unsupervised unless you have a contained outside space for him as he's vulnerable to other cats and predators due to his size and immaturity. Due to this vulnerability it's very likely that he feels unsafe outside and despite wanting to use the tray out there he may be feeling too afraid. It's not really his fault that he has nowhere to go inside and is therefore going on the floor when he's not comfortable going outside.

By putting his tray outside while he's still so young you're forcing his progression and you may end up with unwanted bad habits (such as toileting in the house) if you do this. Ideally he should have access to the tray inside for as long as possible and in most cases cats who are comfortable outside will slowly wean themselves away from the tray when they're ready. I've always kept a tray inside for mine to give them options but in the past when they've had good outside access I've noticed that the tray rarely, if ever, gets used and under those circumstances I'm sure I could've removed the tray entirely without upset but I personally preferred not to as I like mine to have options.

Ideally you need to put the tray back in the house for now and try not to rush the process. It's not so much a matter of toilet training... cats, unlike dogs, will often choose to go outside without any training whatsoever but only when they feel safe and comfortable enough to do so.
Basically what I'm saying is put the tray back in the house for now and leave him to it - as he gets bigger he'll most likely start to go outside more often and when the tray eventually falls into disuse then you're safe to remove it if you really decide that's what you want to do.
Removing it prematurely will only result in an upset kitten and bad toilet habits in the house.

I know it's not what you want to hear but you'll only fight a losing battle under these circumstances and the accidents will keep happening!

[kcsunshine73]

Sarie, thank you; your response really didn't feel like you were having a go - you are right, I have come on here for advice and I don't want to be shouted at, I just need level headed explanations as you have given!
I will absolutely take your advice, and bring the tray back in (or maybe even get a bigger one, as that was a kitten one and he was kicking up litter everywhere making a complete mess in the kitchen). Because we had our other two as rescues when they were mature, we haven't had to go through the kitten stage for quite some time (I last had a kitten in 1995 when I was single, didn't have my own two kids, a husband and a job five days a week - well, I had a job, just not everyone else to look after!) so it is absolutely fantastic to find someone willing to give advice without making me feel like a naughty girl cos I won't treat my kitten like a baby and coo at his poos ... Obviously, he's very cute, although he was supposed to be a girl - the chap my mum got him from (my birthday present as I have been wanting a grey girl for some time) was adamant it was a grey girl ... hmm ... oh well! At least we chose a gender non-specific name for him ...

[SarahT1 [PLLE]]

A bigger litter tray is a great idea, KC. I was surprised how much mess our middle girl made when she first came from rescue. She is tiny but she dug for Australia and eventually I had the wit to realise she needed a bigger tray! Several people seem to have adopted a 'girl' to find out it's not! Lol. I have a grey boy, they are so beautiful. Take care.

[Kay]

a big tray and the litter really deep - that kills most smells and stops a lot of spillage - a fine clumping litter means the clumps can be removed easily and the whole tray doesn't need changing, which keeps costs down, and disposal simpler

I have two of these trays http://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/cat_ ... oxes/98035" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and despite my Tosker being a devil for digging, there is never any spillage as such - just a light scattering

[sarie]

LOL I got a little grey "girl" kitten called Maisie. Turns out she was a boy... she's now called Harvey although all his documents from his kitten jabs still say Maisie on them I think it's a pretty common mistake

There's no cooing at poo for me... frankly cat poo and wee is disgusting and I'll do anything to make my life around it more acceptable. They need to go just as much as I do so it's a necessary evil but I still gag when I clean the tray... anyone who says they enjoy cleaning cat poop is lying My two are indoor now because Harvey has a heart condition and is no longer fit enough to roam safely so I've had to improve my litter resources.

I have a hooded cat litter tray similar to this:
http://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/cat_ ... wwod0qkAGw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I removed the cat flap as my two don't like having a flap on their tray and I should imagine a young kitten would probably be unhappy about a flap too. The hooded trays are great as there's very little litter spillage and it keeps the smells in too. Plus you don't have to look at their chocolate nuggets when they decide burying their excrement is really someone elses job.

I also have a litter mat like this:
http://www.petsathome.com/shop/en/pets/ ... grey-small" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The mat is great and keeps the litter from spreading across the floor when my cats leave the tray so it reduces the mess.

Finally, I have a litter locker to make cleaning the tray stress free and to keep all the disgusting smells contained without me having to take a nappy bag out to the wheelie bin each and every time I clean the tray. This is perhaps overkill for most people but with indoor cats it's a godsend for me
http://www.petmeds.co.uk/Brands-A-Z/P/P ... tAodxVUAPw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Anything to make a gross job more acceptable and not have my house smell like a public toilet

He sounds super cute though; you'll have to share some pictures - what's his non-gender specifc name? Hopefully once you bring his tray back in his accidents will stop and given a little time to get used to his outdoor adventures you'll find his tray use is gradually reduced

[kcsunshine73]

Sarie, I loved your response - poo and wee are, yes, gross. I could just about cope with my own kids (even used cloth nappies for my second!) but with animals, it just smells baaaaad!
He's called Cobweb after a diary in A Midsummer Night's Dream. Shakespeare's anniversary and all that ...
his adoptive big sister (my daughter's beautiful tortie Battersea Old Windsor rescue) is called Ariel (works in relation to Shakespeare again, but also a Disney princess) and the big fat boy we got first is called Simba - he's not the most handsome of fellas, but he's a soppy old thing a bit like bag puss - he's white with ginger splurges and is my teenage son's rescue.
The kitten was the one meant for me ... he's a mini version (getting less mini though!) of the Sheba advert grey cat. Very elegant looking but utterly naughty, much more so than the others ever were, breaking things, pulling things over etc ... just waiting for him to stop being so manic! He attacks the other two too - the old boy tolerates it, the girl hisses. Got better once we got feliway - she had stopped coming into the house, which was really worrying ... she's better now and my tween daughter looks after her by fetching her in through a different door so she doesn't have to go past the bully boys!
Haven't been able to face the **** tray outside in the rain, so will either root around in the garage for a bigger one I had when our other two were in transit between houses, or pop down to whatever that big pet store is that they have ubiquitously at every trading centre ...
He has managed to avoid the newly tin foiled area he'd been using, so he's been a good boy for 24 hours ... and thank god I've not been up to my ankles in cat wee again ..

[Crewella]

He sounds lovely, and Cobweb is a lovely name.

I use hooded litter trays as well - they do save a heck of a lot of mess. I took the 'catflap' doors off mine though - none of mine liked them.

[sarie]

Haha Cobweb, that's such a cool name Although it did make me briefly think of Drop Dead Fred... if you've seen it you'll know what I mean HAHA.

Bless he sounds adorable! Kittens are so naughty though... I love their naughty phase although it does get a bit exhausting when you're constantly having to watch what they're doing and clean up after them. Clive went through a phase of digging in the pots of the house plants and then trampling the soil through the house - and occasionally tipping the plant over entirely. He also climbed curtains, scaled my legs and chewed wires. Ahh kittens ! I'm glad your other two are tolerating him though as they can be a bit of a handful for older cats at times hehe. Ariel and Simba, that made me smile

Sounds like you have a lovely furry brood! Hopefully once you get Cobweb's litter troubles under control then you can continue to enjoy his kitten phase I used to sometimes wish the manic kitten phase away but it doesn't really last that long and once they're all grown up you sometimes wish it back - it's hard to be grumpy/sad when there's a kitten in the house as they're so darn happy all the time

[SarahT1 [PLLE]]

I think a picture of the lovely Cobweb is in order now!

[kcsunshine73]

Will try - my photos are too big to post though and I don't have the will to convert them to anything...