Can anyone explain this?

[MysticalVamp]

*I apologise for the following essay!!!*

I've run into a bit of a problem with my two lovelies...
Sox is my 8 year old black & white tuxedo moggy, Tiger is my tabby moggy who is 4 years old in October.

Tiger used to be quite an independent cat, he wasn't much for fuss and would never come and lay on you. Sox has always been the opposite and always been a mummies boy.

Around about November last year, things changed a lot. Tiger became a lot more of a mummies boy and suddenly decided he wanted to curl up on me a lot more. I have no idea what caused this change, maybe he's just maturing now(this was just after he turned 3 years old) and this has caused him to calm down?
However, that does not match up with his other behavioural changes...

Around about the same time, he started having random moments where he would run around the flat at top speed. Knocking things over, etc... During his "mad moments" he looked crazy, I mean truly mental.... Wide eyes, ears back, fur raised... This concerned me so I kept looking for a trigger, but there didn't seem to be any! It usually happens at night, but occasionally during he day.

The other thing that concerned me is that he started attacking Sox. They've never fought before, but at the time everything else happened- He started attacking Sox as well. I don't mean he has a quick swipe as Sox walks past, I mean he actively chases Sox down and pins him to the floor.... Sox ends up yowling and sometimes fur literally flies. This isn't happening all the time, most of the time they aren't bothered by each others presence and even clean each other! And then other times, again mostly at night, they fight... There's never any injury to Sox apart from maybe a bit of lost fur, but not enough to cause a noticeable injury.
Despite that, it's got to the point where I'm considering separating them at night and when we're out to prevent injury while I'm not around. But that would mean locking one of them in the bedroom/bathroom area and the other in the hallway/kitchen area... This is no issue for when we're out, but regularly at night they both curl up on the bed with me. One laid on my back and the other on my legs.

This is why this new behaviour is so confusing! It's like he can't decide whether he likes Sox or not, despite them being together for nearly 3 years when this started... We've had Tiger since he was 8 weeks old, and Sox has never had a problem with him... Until around about November last year, that was a shared feeling.
Tiger has been at the vets, in case it's something bothering him personally- The vet can't find any issues... I mentioned that he's attacking Sox, I explained about Sox yowling because he's pinned. He said that due to the fact that there's no injury he thinks maybe Sox is playing on my emotions in a way. Sort of how a kid might cry for hours over a paper cut because they know they'll get sympathy from their mum. I'm not sure how likely this is, but the vet seemed pretty certain that as long as there's no resulting injuries they should be OK?

These photo's were taken yesterday, Tiger in the cat bed and Sox on the floor not far from it. As you can see, neither cares that they are nearby..

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[bobbys girl]

In our house it is known as 'the Zoomies'. They all do it, but Purdy is the one that does it most often. So much so we call her 'the wall of death' cat, as she runs so fast she can run around the wall several feet off the ground! Occasionally it results in a spat with another cat, but it is nothing to worry about.

After Tommy died there was a bit of a power struggle and now there is no one to stop Grace being a bully. But they still all pile up on the sofa together in the evening.

I don't think you have too much to worry about. They will sort things out.

BTW lovely photos.

[MysticalVamp]

In our house it is known as 'the Zoomies'. They all do it, but Purdy is the one that does it most often. So much so we call her 'the wall of death' cat, as she runs so fast she can run around the wall several feet off the ground! Occasionally it results in a spat with another cat, but it is nothing to worry about.

After Tommy died there was a bit of a power struggle and now there is no one to stop Grace being a bully. But they still all pile up on the sofa together in the evening.

I don't think you have too much to worry about. They will sort things out.

BTW lovely photos.

Thanks for that reassurance.

Do you know what could have made Tiger randomly change how he did? It was as if someone swapped him for another cat. He frequently lays near/on me now and every single night they lay on me, Tiger on my back and Sox on my legs or occasionally next to me.
Do you think Tiger will maybe stop being such a bully to Sox one day? The vet suggested maybe start walking him, on a harness and lead, in case he's just got a lot of pent up energy. I can't see how that will work out but I'm willing to give it a try if he'll co-operate lol.

[bobbys girl]

A harness and lead might make him worse.

Our Gracie was very stand-offish for years. Then suddenly she's daddy's girl and follows him EVERYWHERE. She can't even leave him alone in the loo! She still treats me like 'staff'!

[meriad]

I wonder whether Tiger is trying to figure out if he wants to be top cat or not? And when he does he'll have a go at Sox, but when he thinks he's OK as is being the 'junion' he's just fine and happy.

You could always try plugging in a Feliway and see if that makes a difference? It may well work in this case.

I have six cats - and they all generally get on just fine; but Monty (who is cat nr 3) never has been overly fond of Harry (cat 4)... both boys; both neutered (I'm assuming yours are as well?); and they're about 2 years apart. Monty's particular flash point is if he's trying to get from point A to and Harry happens to be in the way. Monty will, without fail, speed it up a bit whilst grumbling and hissing, stop for a quick swipe and then swiftly carry on. Harry meanwhile just looks on totally bemused - they are funny creatures, they really are

I gather from your comments that your cats are house cats? Is there no way they could have access to outside? Personally I'm not overly fond of harnesses, but that's a different matter.

What's the set up in your home, how many high up places do they have they can get to? Look out of a window watch the world go by?

[MysticalVamp]

Bobbys Girl: How so? Obviously if it's going to make him worse I don't want to risk it but the vet was pretty insistent it might help get rid of some pent up energy to walk him! O.o

Meriad: I wonder that myself sometimes. Even after over three years I wonder if he's maybe just not sure what he wants? Indecisive cat lol.
I've tried a feliway, no difference at all. Had it plugged in for a month to use up the bottle and give it time to work. Nothing changed sadly.

Yes, both boys and both neutered. The difference is that while Sox was neutered quite young, Tiger wasn't neutered until he was about 12-18 months old. So he was quite a bit older than Sox. Not sure if that could have effected hormones, etc...

The difference between yours and mine is that with mine it's all or nothing. There's no in between, no quick swipe. It's tackle or groom each other :/

They are house cats as we live in a third floor flat- Plus the fact that I am a very paranoid person. A foster cat I had last year got hit by a car and was killed on impact. I couldn't deal with that and even though she was no longer my cat at the time, I cried for a long time(and still do occasionally) when I heard about Lily being hit. If it was one of my boys... I dread to think what sort of state I'd end up in.
There are two walls in the living room with a 10in wide ledge that goes along the entire length of those two walls. They like to sit at the living room window and watch the world outside, both will sit there together as can be seen by this photo. They also sit in the kitchen and look out the kitchen window, Tiger has even taken his chance at jumping ONTO the roof through the skylight when I've left it open... Even with me sat next to it, he took a running leap and out he went. Luckily I had treats next to me and shook the bag. Instantly back in the room.
Anyone would think they were deprived of sunlight! Lol.

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*Yes I am aware that the Kalanchoe next to them is toxic to cats. This is the reason they are not allowed in the living room when no-one is here/at night. The plant has now been cut down and is spread between two pots as I plan to get rid. Not because of the cats, they aren't bothered by it at all and the only plant they try to eat is my Wandering Jew which is non-toxic. I just don't feel it anymore. It was nice when it flowered, but I've not been able to get it to flower a second time...

[Crewella]

Personally, I think they're getting on pretty well and you're possibly reading too much into what sounds like boisterous play.

I have five cats that mix in the house at the moment, and the biggest (and youngest) is Daz, who likes to chase the others now and again. For a while I was really worried about Basil, who came to me as a stray with a badly broken leg which has set at an odd angle that has given him a pronounced limp and who screams blue murder sometimes when Daz chases him. Until the day when they galloped past me at high speed, Basil limping and screaming in front and Daz behind ......... then two minutes later Daz steamed back past me with Basil limping along behind ..... and I realised I was reading too much into the whole scenario!

I'm not too keen on harnesses either, there's too much that can go wrong and the thought of a cat getting loose trailing a lead is horrifying. I have only used one with one particular cat, who was very, very laid back and that was a long time ago .... I'm not sure I'd do it at all now. I do agree that it might help to tire him out a bit though, maybe with something like a laser pen?

[MysticalVamp]

Personally, I think they're getting on pretty well and you're possibly reading too much into what sounds like boisterous play.

I have five cats that mix in the house at the moment, and the biggest (and youngest) is Daz, who likes to chase the others now and again. For a while I was really worried about Basil, who came to me as a stray with a badly broken leg which has set at an odd angle that has given him a pronounced limp and who screams blue murder sometimes when Daz chases him. Until the day when they galloped past me at high speed, Basil limping and screaming in front and Daz behind ......... then two minutes later Daz steamed back past me with Basil limping along behind ..... and I realised I was reading too much into the whole scenario!

I'm not too keen on harnesses either, there's too much that can go wrong and the thought of a cat getting loose trailing a lead is horrifying. I have only used one with one particular cat, who was very, very laid back and that was a long time ago .... I'm not sure I'd do it at all now. I do agree that it might help to tire him out a bit though, maybe with something like a laser pen?

When these two chase, Sox ends up backed into a corner somewhere and both end up looking longhair they puff out that much... Ears back and everything.. Sometimes it takes a good 10 mins before Sox will come out of wherever he's been backed into.

They do play rough too, and there's definitely a difference between that and when Tiger chases Sox into a corner...

We have a laser pen but were told if we're going to use it we NEED to give them a reward for "catching" the light otherwise they become frustrated which is bad for their health. The problem is, they don't take the reward. I've tried toys, treats, etc.. Nothing. So I don't want to use the laser pen if it's going to cause frustration in them because they won't take the reward afterwards? Again, vets advice regarding Tigers behaviour as I mentioned laser pens and toys and stuff...

[Crewella]

Actually, I'm not a big user of laser pens myself ... I was just trying to think of something to tire him out! The 'feather on elastic' type toys are also good for a workout!

I agree that this is slightly more than just play, this is also a display of one cats need to dominate the other. BUT the fact that they're OK with each other for most of the time tells me that they really are managing to work this out between themselves. Cats are not really domesticated, remember .... they do still behave like wild animals and life is tougher out there that we humans would really like it to be. By all means, keep an eye on them.

[MysticalVamp]

Actually, I'm not a big user of laser pens myself ... I was just trying to think of something to tire him out! The 'feather on elastic' type toys are also good for a workout!

I agree that this is slightly more than just play, this is also a display of one cats need to dominate the other. BUT the fact that they're OK with each other for most of the time tells me that they really are managing to work this out between themselves. Cats are not really domesticated, remember .... they do still behave like wild animals and life is tougher out there that we humans would really like it to be. By all means, keep an eye on them.

He's not much of a toy type cat unfortunately xD He likes dangly toys, and we have a "fishing pole" toy but he is obsessed with chewing the wire instead of the toy... And he likes to swallow any wire he breaks which is a huge risk. So we have to be very careful with those.

Yeah, I agree it sounds like they just have moments. I just found it weird that it suddenly started happening last year at the same time Tiger started being a mummies boy. Jealousy maybe?! Lol.

[randall]

I formerly had two male housecasts who were adopted as kittens at the same time -- they might have been brothers, I wasn't sure. Anyway, they got along fine but at least six times a year, they did exactly what your two cats are doing. Generally it was the larger of the two who always started it.

I had a 3 story house with 13 rooms, so when they went tearing through the house there was almost no hope of my catching up and separating them. Neither of the cats was ever injured, despite the fact the fur literally flew from the swipes they landed on each other. Their yowling and scraming was deafening -- and while it is true the cats were never injured, I did lose a lamp and some other breakables, as they also jumped on tables and countertops during the melee.

Once or twice, I was able to slam a door between them, but had I tried to keep the separate for long, they would have just scratched up the doors trying to get to each other.

Both males were neutered, but they still had sexual feelings, and sometimes their roughhousing had elements of rape-like behavior and resistance to it.

With such a large house, with multiple stair cases, these cats got daily exercise, so I don't think walks would have made much difference. If your vet is telling you to keep them apart, or is warning you that one of the cats is in real danger of being injured by the other, I'm not trying to contradict that. I'm just saying my cats lived to be 16 years old, never hurt each other, but had some blow out fisticuffs along the way.

[bobbys girl]

Sorry for not getting back to you, I've been making the most of the dry weather and getting jobs done in the garden.

After Bob had his leg amputated we thought it would be a good idea for him to get some gentle exercise outside and that a harness was the way to go. He HATED it and either ran around in circles or refused to move at all. I'll try and post a picture of him - not looking a happy bunny. BTW I am having trouble posting photo's since the sites re-vamp?

Not a happy bunny

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I think the expression says it all.

Easier said than done, but try not to worry about what is happening, cos the little darlings pick up on that. To hear the noises they make sometimes, you would think they were trying to tear each other apart. Next minute they are cuddled up on the sofa together. Cats eh!

[MysticalVamp]

Randall: I find clumps of Sox's fur on the floor sometimes after they've chased. And yes, I've lost a mirror to Tiger through his rampaging... He climbed the wooden frame and the entire thing came shattering down with him. Luckily he was uninjured, my mirror on the other hand...

The vet isn't recommending keep them apart, the vet is actually saying it just sounds like Sox is "playing it up" so to speak and essentially crying wolf. He just recommended a harness as he thinks maybe Tiger has some pent up energy... But I'm not sure on the harness now...

Bobbys Girl: Don't blame you! We've had a bit of sun today and I've revelled in it lol.
I was thinking of maybe getting him used to the harness in the flat first, then slowly walking him down the stairs in the building and seeing how he goes with it. He's quite an adventurous cat so no issues there, the main problem would be having a weird thing strapped on to him lol.

I got this last night. They don't hate each other, they just have moments lol. And then when it comes to their delicious Natures Menu, they band together

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*Yeah, Sox has a pink camo collar. Tiger's is red and says "Keep Calm and Chill Out" lol.

After he was fully satisfied, Tiger promptly sprawled out on the floor.

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[bobbys girl]

The first picture says 'butter wouldn't melt...'. Such a look of innocence!

The other two pics look very familiar. How do they DO that!

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[MysticalVamp]

The first picture says 'butter wouldn't melt...'. Such a look of innocence!

The other two pics look very familiar. How do they DO that!

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Cats are liquid, I've decided
They fit in small spaces and conform to that space, they are highly flexible and they can get from one place to another in seconds if they hear/see something they like