Cat Chat Feline Forum

Hello,

this is going to be a long post, so bare with me (i like to apologise for any grammar mistake, english isn't my first language).

I have 3 cats (all neutered), 1 big orange male (Simao) 8ys old, and 2 females (a black cute one (Mia) 6yrs old, and one sassy calico (Buffy), 7yrs old). One of the females (the calico of course) was always the alpha, and the male as always the shy one. The calico, Buffy, and the male, Simao, never were the best of friends, but they got along, and in the cold days their were often spotted sleeping together, and the black, Mia, one always got along with the other two, but especially with the Buffy.

Well in the end of March one night while all were sleeping with us in bed, they all starting to have the fight of their lives (they never fought like that before). We immediately separated them, and on the next morning they were great, after one week at the end of their 2nd meal of the day, the Buffy started fighting with Simao (male), and Mia got involved and started fighting with the Buffy. We again separated them, but after that Buffy, couldn't see the sights of the male she started hissing and growling to him.
Every time Buffy tried to fight with the male he always hided really scared, but Mia, always got in the middle of the fight, so it always ended with both girls fighting, but with a little time off both of the girls always got along even if they got involved in the fight with each other, always best friends, sleeping together, etc...

With a little patience (and with some bumps on the road (they getting away and starting fighting)) we managed to Simao and Buffy to stay in the same room, and even be calm, and for a brief moments even sleeping in the same sofa. But always distrusting each other, and with a moments of lower ears, or Buffy trying to chase Simao (we would run afraid), but we could manage to calm they down.

1month ago we had almost 15days of peaceful times, even though we didn't trust them together without us. But were moments they were so great we even forget and let them all day together, and arriving home with them all sleeping together at bed.

We thought everything was getting better until one night that Mia was sleeping with Simao but suddenly started to growling to him really loud, we quickly separated them.
Since then she is REALLY strange, she can be really nice with no signs of mistrust and really calm, even playing next to any of them, or eating, or sleeping, but suddenly she starts to hissing.
For example:
The first night we notice this, she was the entire night with Simao (without Buffy) and when we got to sleep they both went to bed, she was ok, but he went out of bed to drink water, and when he got back to bed she suddenly growl to him...
Next day she was calmer, we tried to join Mia and Buffy together, they were ok, smelling each other, no big deal, when she went to the sofa, and Buffy tried to get to sleep next to her she did the same as before, growl to her...
Today we tried to give them food together (Mia and Buffy) and Mia was ok, they got across each other path with no problem, but again Buffy got close together (nothing strange cause they already were really close) she growl again...

And since that time Buffy is acting really strange too she's doesn't get out of her "safe place", she can be in the same place with Simao, but always looking at him with no trust, and if he sometimes goes near her (not always) she lower her ears, and runs away from him.

And when sees Mia hisses to her immediately.

And Simao who was the scary one is now confident, and is never scare of the girls, even when they hiss (or lower their hears) to them.

So i don't know what to do now.... I'm really desperate, when we are not home we always changing the room were they are, at the night when we are sleeping the same.
When we are home we let Buffy being with Simao, even if she doesn't trust him and she always on her safe place (is on the top of a tower of cardboard cubes, inside of one).

Do i should let Buffy being with Simao, sometimes she relaxes, and even comes to the sofa (where Simaos always is)? (i always try to give them treats and have play time, or comb her when they are together)

What should i do to make buffy relax a little with Simao? So she's not so "stiff" with him?

And Mia that i can't let be with none of them??
I can't understand why she reacts like this, be ok and suddenly snapping.

Mia and Buffy were the best of friends, always together, sleeping together, so it breaks my heart seeing those two can't standing each other...

Im really really desperate and sad .

Someone as an idea of what can i do to improve the situation??

They were so great, almost getting along again, and things got even worst!! :'(

Please help me, i really need :'(.


Thank you
Vanessa

Dear Vanessa,

I'm no expert, but two things - Buffy's change of behaviour with the other cats (which is intermittent to some extent) and the fact that she's tending to stay in one safe spot as if she's separating herself - make me wonder whether she could be ill and in pain? Have you taken her to a vet for a proper check and some blood tests? Any change in behaviour like this can be a signal of pain or illness (even humans are crabby when we hurt). If it were a sudden incident that had resolved with your very patient, careful techniques, then I might have though redirected aggression (so being upset by something (for example a cat outside the property) and taking it out on those close to her.

If she were not well it could be that the others are challenging her alpha status?

So for me, the fact that it's gone on, and she's semi-hiding, sounds like she needs to see the vet for some tests, even if just to rule out health issues.

Please let us know how she is.

Hi Jacks,
thanks for the reply!

Well i actually have one of the cats hill, but is Mia, she's has a colitis, and this Friday she undergo a colonoscopy, she had a wound on her colon, waiting for the biopsy to find out if isn't something being it.
So this couple days she's on a really really bad mood.

Simao in the beginning with all the stress he was starting a urinary inflammation, he as urinary problems, so stress isn't the best for him, so when this started i when immediately with him to the vet, fortunately for that.

But Buffy is the only one that is actually ok (i took her to the vet too).

She's doesn't seem at all in pain, she's just seem that lost her normal confident, more anxious... and all started after Mia started hissing to her, she was really lonely (she was always near Mia) and sad after that, and now she's immediately hisses to her....

About the redirect aggression i don't know, cause I live on the 11th floor, and on front of me i just have the view to the city. Cant see other cats, or smell them.

I think this started because Simao and Mia started being on diet, and i stop having food always available to having meal times (I'm going to revert that)

This is a link to the Cat Chat advice page on aggression, just in case there is anything there that might help you:

http://www.catchat.org/cat_aggression.html

Hi Crewella,

Thanks for the help, I think I already had read this...
I think I already read everything about it on the web! I'm really desperate

But I feel in the case of Mia and Buffy the situation isn't as simple..
But I will continuing doing by the book (will way first that Mia gets well, she's really stressed right now, still because of the colonoscopy )

All these vet visits will also make the problem worse as cats tend to come home from the vets smelling different and that can cause problems with the cats that stayed home. It might help to try scent-swopping and rub the incoming cat all over with a cloth and then rub the cloth over the others, and vice versa.

Hmmm good idea !! I'm gonna try it!!!

The thing that is worrying me even more is that I already have planned vacations for a while in 10days, and they're going to be 11days alone, each one in his separate room, my father is going to visit then, but is never the same thing, and it's only once a day visit...
I already have everything paid... But I'll be worrying the entire trip !

When I came back from it in thinking of doing a new introduction to each one of the cats... See if it helps...

Just an update!

Mia is a good mood since she arrived from the vet.
And i put the cat tree that was in one of the balconies on the living room (they are protected with the net), but because i have those closed because i connected the feliway friends (multicat) and the "normal", so didnt made sense they were outside. Buffy LOVED IT to have the cat tree inside, she now comes out from her boxs fort, and runs around to jump to the cat tree. Much more happier and confident.

So they are all on a better mood, dont know if Feliway Multicat helped, or if it was all the above. But yesterday i was able to make all of the 3 eat "near" each other, without hisses or growlings.
Mia after eating even smelled Simao on the nose (i was all the time petting Simao, so while she was smelling his nose he was purring).
And through just a inch of open door Mia smelled buffy too, and no one got scared .

I dont want to force it, so I'm letting them smelling and eating together for a brief period of time, and even play through the bottom of the door, so they see each other little paw trying to catch the toy.

Hope this works.


Now I'm just worried with Mia, cause since she arrived from the vet she doesnt let me touch her back toes, im afraid she got hurt in the vet somehow.. i notice one of her nails got broken, and was even blood in the carrier, but the toe next to that she doesnt move or let us touch..
she walks normally, but gets really really mad when we try to touch it... can be a broken toe??? This friday is the followup from the colonoscopy and we going to see that.

Im afraid if is something worst all the progress with them is reversed,,,

Great news about the progress! It sounds like Mia got her toes caught at the vet or in the carrier and she may need to have that looked at. You're doing the right thing taking things slowly and carefully - every good day will make the next good day more likely! Sounds like you've turned a corner. If Mia has a torn toe and is in pain it will need to be seen to - I'm sure that won't spoil anything.

Hi,

well Mia in the Vet let touch her toe, was just a broken nail, she probably was more sensitive and didnt let us touch, and the biopsy and she as a infiltration of gastrointestinal tissue (??) that created the ulcer, basic she as to do a treatment with corticosteroids... (only going to start when i get back from vacations )
But her mood is really really much better. She can be now (with supervision) in the same room with the other cats, and she gets near them, even smell them, and no hissing .

Now the only one more defensive in Buffy, that still doesnt want to get to near with near of the other cats, with Simao, she's a little "more relaxed", when Mia isnt in the same room, she gets out of her box on the top of the tower, but never wants to sit were Simao is, when Mia is in the room, she (like in the beginning) dont get out of the box. and is always looking at her when she moves.

Yesterday at night, after beeing the entire day in the same room with Mia, Buffy actually walked near her to get out of the room (Mia was laying down close to the door) and no hissing, and Mia she just didnt care.

Today morning, they eated together, but we separeted them aftewards, but Buffy runned way and entered in the room were Mia was, and they got face to face, and buffy hissed at her (Mia didnt reacted), and we separated them immediately, no fights.

so now i think the struggle is to get Buffy more confident, dont know what to do with her, just patience? and continuing doing what im doing?

thank you all for your replys.
Vanessa