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Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:50 am
by Ducky
I am currently fostering a young female Kitty from my local rescue. She was previously rehomed from them (last year) with a suspected food allergy, but was returned to the rescue in May with apparently the same issue, albeit now worse. She has scratch wounds to both sides of her neck (where a collar would lie) and to both sides of her face and temple. As soon as they dry up she will scratch away the scabs again. I don't see her scratching all that frequently, but it only takes the one attack and the wound is open again.

She came home with me on the 18th of June. The next day I started her on James Wellbeloved turkey dry food, on recommendation. She has had absolutely nothing else in the meantime other than fresh cool water from a Brita filter jug, which is changed every day, and which she seems to like.

I am cleaning the wounds with colloidal silver, either with a clean cotton pad or from a spray bottle if the wound looks too sore to touch. I am rubbing a little coconut oil into the dry scabs to try to keep the skin supple and stop them from itching, although to what extent this is working I don't know.

She has been on 2mg (half a tablet) of Piriton twice daily since she came here. On the 1st of July I took her to see the rescue vet for a check-up. She gave her a long-lasting steroid injection and put her on 50mg of Synulox twice daily which we are just about to finish. It's hard to tell whether any of the wounds are infected... sometimes after a scratching session they will look wet but they do not smell or ooze anything nasty.

She has an inflatable collar which does stop her scratching her head and neck but she sulks terribly and doesn't seem inclined to eat or drink with it on, although I think she could if she wanted to. With the weather we're having, I don't want to take the chance that it stops her from drinking.

She is staying in my spare bedroom at the moment, with a garden view and a choice of beds, a cool mat and a fan (which is on permanently at the moment given the ferocious heat). She likes to chat to the birds in the tree (!!) and she gets visits and fuss all throughout the day. At least once in the day I will shut the other cats downstairs and let her have the roam of upstairs. She likes to lounge about on my bed whilst I'm working. She is an absolute sweetheart, a real kitty princess. She suffers the pill-popping and swabbing and nonsense like a little soldier and she really deserves her own little castle and flower garden. She will make some lucky person's life complete. Unfortunately, nobody is likely to take her on until this is sorted.

I'm in this for the long haul so I'm open to any and all suggestions and recommendations of what might be causing this and what I can try to get to the bottom of it.

As ever, all help gratefully received.

Pictures to follow.

D.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:45 am
by Lilith
Hi and welcome :)

Wow - Lucy is one lucky cat!

I'm not an expert (though other people on here are) but I can definitely recommend coconut oil. Unless you're a gourmet who wants it for special dishes, just the cheapest brand will do. In this sun, although the rest of me is the colour of an Amazon box, my collarbones objected (haven't had any proper sun in Wakefield for years) but the coconut oil is a miracle cure for sore flaky skin. A member on here recommends Hypercal ointment, which is another very good one.

You've come to the right place - many members do rescue and fostering and many are very knowledgeable re meds so I think you'll get plenty of support.

Fusses to Lucy and all the very best :)

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:26 am
by Janey
Hi and welcome :) So sorry for your little foster cat, it must awful for them. I too have a cat like this, it’s an ongoing thing so I’ve posted a few times about this in reply to others, and just found a couple of threads I’ll give you the links to, they may be helpful:

https://www.catchat.org/felineforum/vie ... lar#p49211

Most recent:

https://www.catchat.org/felineforum/vie ... 531#p52531

I hope you get this under control for her, give her a fuss from me xx

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:46 am
by fjm
I'm the one who swears by HyperCal - the ointment not the cream. The lanolin seems to keep scabs from forming, and it has sorted most sore skin problems for my cats in a couple of applications. Pippin reacts very badly to surgical spirit, although it took me a while to work out what was causing the problem - as he had repeated blood tests earlier in the year the HyperCal got a thorough testing!

Poor little cat - she is lucky to have you.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:32 am
by Lilith
Ah sorry Fjm, I'm not precise :oops:

Ah, I did say ointment didn't I? Sorry, I'm scatty these days, too much sun and ongoing projects and evil pc lol.

I thought there was just the stuff in the tube and also the Hypercal tincture, which is also marvellous - I was once prescribed that by a homeopathic vet for a cat with awful abscesses after stomach surgery; some of the skin was necrotic but that guy survived (it was my George the Beast of Bodmin who lived to nearly 18.) His usual vets seemed quite impressed.

I'll post the link for this if mods will allow as, unlike the ointment, it's not generally available; I always keep it in and get it online now -

https://www.tessajordan.co.uk/shop/Home ... edies.aspx

Again good luck with Lucy, Ducky :)

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:58 am
by fjm
You were very precise, Lilith, and definitely said ointment! Just trying to share a good thing as widely as possible. Nelsons used to do an ointment, but now only do the cream, which I have found not nearly as effective. Weleda still do the ointment fortunately. Interesting that you have found the tincture helpful - I have some I bought from a tiny herbalist shop in Greece years ago and have not yet used. Perhaps I should!

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:03 am
by Ducky
This is really encouraging! I'm excited to try new things and to keep her away from nasty steroids if I can help it.

After my last stint at stray-fostering with Sir Humphrey (https://www.catchat.org/felineforum/vie ... 007#p51007 ...which I will update shortly!) I figured I'd try and stick to healthy, independent cats! But I found myself making a promise to this little lady and here were are again! She's such a good girl. I've never known a cat like her. She's not bitten or scratched me once, or even tried. Not so much as a hiss. She squeaks like a cheeky mouse when I walk in and rolls over on her back to show me her belly. She's just started to play with her little toys and her favourite is an eight inch long piece of black ribbon which she attacks with gusto. She has the most amazing bright, owly eyes and thick, soft fur with lovely white socks. If it wasn't for having to keep her away from the other cats' food I'd adopt her in a heartbeat and go and get myself a paper round (that would make 4!) but she really deserves all the attention she can get as an only cat. She's a proper heartstealer.

Hi Lilith; that Tessa Jordan link... I can't find an ointment listed... only a tincture. Does that matter?

FJM: There is also a Weleda Wound Salve (but I can't find an ointment)... Is this worth trying too?

At some point, I need to think about the diet aspect of this. How long does it usually take for allergens in food to leave the system? I've read that this could be up to 8 weeks but that seems quite excessive. On the other hand, the rescue vet seemed to think that after two weeks it would be obvious whether or not she was eating something that made her itch but that doesn't seem a particularly long time. She's been on this particular food for 3 weeks now and I'm wondering whether I should leave her on it for a bit longer?

What are the chances that the scratching is actually more to do with the scabs healing, and less to do with allergens in her diet? I suppose that's the million dollar question! I figured, if her diet was making her itch then she be scratching a lot more often. I'll step up the coconut oil treatment and see if it makes any difference.

Thank you Janey; I will bring up those links tomorrow and have a good read and make some notes.

Let's see if I can upload a couple of gratituous pics...

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:16 am
by Ducky
https://photos.app.goo.gl/bRUHhFz6bh5w44Fw9

https://photos.app.goo.gl/nULNTbowH4cdeyEz9

The second picture is where I found her peering out at me after 3 hours frantically searching for her. I'd nipped home during my lunch to check on her and couldn't find her anywhere. She is confined to the spare room when I'm out and I searched it at least four times and concluded that she must have escaped out of a window that was only slightly open. I trawled the immediate streets calling her, I climbed over all the neighbouring gardens in my work dress, calling her and shaking treats. I had my next door neighbour looking and my brother out from work during his lunch looking for her. It was only my second day in a new job and there's me having a cheeky three hour lunch break, but there was no way I could go back to work without finding her. In that time I put three posts on local lost and found FB pages, contacted the local vets and ask them to post her missing, printed 40 flyers and posted them through all the doors in the neighbouring streets and put for posters up on telegraph poles. I got back to the house and went back to the bedroom and I sat on the floor and was ready to cry when I heard a noise... I turned my head and peered Into the darkness and found this little face peering back at me. I said "I don't believe this...".... "come out you little ferret!". And out she crawls from inside my sewing basket, has a massive stretch and totters off for a snack. My nerves were absolutely shot.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:13 am
by Janey
She is adorable. Sorry but I had to have a little chuckle to myself at her hiding :lol: nawty little minx!! don’t they scare us! I had a similar experience when I fostered two kittens. Turned out they were up my chimney on a little ledge, worried me silly they did!! Give her a snuggle from me and tell her not to scare her foster mum again like that x

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:48 am
by fjm
Little madam - happily snoozing while you comb the neighbourhood!

I think Weleda do two wound salves - one with just calendula, and HyperCal, which is hypericum and calendula.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:00 am
by Lilith
Ohh the bad lass! I've had scares like that - once two kittens decided to get into the back of the ... fridge :o Not the chilly bit, you understand, but right round at the back, where there's a ventilation gap for the motor. Nice and warm there, they said.

Yes, I meant the tincture. It isn't an ointment, it's a distillation I think; it's liquid and smells like very good sherry. It keeps for years. I think I used a few drops in water for George but I've used it neat on me. It's powerfully antiseptic and healing. Tessa Jordan would advise you about the precise amount to put in water for bathing.

I think you could well be right about itchy scabs - who hasn't wanted to scratch when something's healing? I've seen vets peel scabs off cats, which shocked me - the scab's there to protect, after all.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:52 am
by Lilith
Ah! Remembered this too (you will be bombarded with info, sorry lol.)

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Anti-Bacterial ... tic+powder

It was way back in the 70s when a cat of mine got prescribed antiseptic powder to dry up a weeping sore and that stuff was wonderful ... errrm I actually snitched some of it for me (there was plenty) because shoes were silly in those days (as they are now) and I always had blisters that turned into raw sores ...

By the way Lucy is lovely - I do like black tuxes, my Mouse is the same, with half a white moustache, but a lot bigger and heavier and Siamesey ... love Lucy's owly eyes :D

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:37 pm
by Janey
Like Lilith I have antiseptic powders, namely these two, they’re very similar:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Johnsons-Veter ... powder+cat

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vetzyme-Antiba ... 9XH6EW0VW3

you can get them from pet shops or Amazon etc.

I didn’t mention it because it’s on one of my threads (I previously mentioned) but did find it good along with the comfy collar, before I was given the steroid cream. My cat’s still itching and getting the pimples but if I keep watch and use the Isaderm it seems to stop it breaking out and bleeding - or her scatching until it does!

It could be foods my cat is irritated to but far more likely something in warm weather because it seems to flare up after easter time.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:09 am
by Ducky
Morning ladies,

Thanks again for the feedback and recommendations. I've just ordered some wound powder, and some hypercal ointment and hopefully they will arrive this week and we can give them a go. I think I'll order the tincture as well as a backup so that it's at least here if all else fails.

I went in to see her this morning and found that she'd scratched her face raw again and it's a right mess of blood, fur and old scabs. The wound on her left temple is now making it's way down to her chin. It's really disheartening to see her like this. I've sprayed the wounds with colloidal silver but she absolutely hates the spray bottle and I'm hoping the powder will be a lot less traumatic for her.

I think we may have to have a bit of collar time this weekend. I can keep an eye on her and take it off so she can drink and eat but these ones seem to have no time to heal before she attacks them again.

Question: Do you think the 2mg of Piriton is enough twice daily? I think I found that dosage on a few posts on here but there is also mention of giving the full 4mg tablet albeit it may make them sleepy. Should I give that a try?

Another question: Am I right in concentrating on healing these wounds first or should I be paying more attention to what she's eating, just in case they are linked?

Poor Lucy. I feel we might have a long road ahead of us.

/deep breath

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:51 am
by Janey
What does the vet say? I used to use the comfy collar and the powder but the vet ended up giving me the steroid cream because although the over the counter stuff helped, it would come back. Allergies are a nightmare, my cat is still scratching but the Isaderm cream is keeping it under control and she’s not bleeding when I use that.

I’ve just found an old thread discussing this - with a picture of my cat Tasha. This was using flea treatment, collar and powder, but before the vet prescribed the steroid cream:

https://www.catchat.org/felineforum/vie ... 493#p41493

As you can see this is when the sore had healed a fair bit.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 6:22 pm
by Ducky
That's a good question, Janey. I don't know much about Lucy's vet history. I haven't even been able to find out what food she was on when she was first rehomed, or even if that was working for her. Nobody seems to know. I've been told that they've 'tried steroids' and I remember seeing a Synulox box outside her pen when she first came back in. So this is all a bit of a stab in the dark. I ordered an inflatable collar (the 'comfy collar') for her when she was still in rescue, because she was struggling to eat and drink with the e-collar on, but when I turned up the next week she wasn't wearing it. Apparently she was taking it off by herself. And when I brought her home, I asked to bring it away with her but nobody knew where it was. So I ordered another one. She doesn't like it but it's the best of a bad bunch.

When I took her back to the rescue to see the on-site vet two weeks ago, it was suggested that she was still on the wrong food, even though she had only been on it for less than 2 weeks. I suggested that perhaps she was scratching because her scabs were itching, bit this was swiftly dismissed. She had a steroid jab and a 10-day course of Synulox. I didn't really come away feeling like I had much direction but equally, I'm happy enough to manage this by myself (with a little help, thank you ladies!).

As an aside I have read that head and neck itching is connected to diet and allergens in food. Is this anyone else's understanding?

I'm excited to try the wound powder. I might use a clean blusher brush and load it up and dab it on. That'll be so much less traumatic for her.

Here she is today, lazing on my bed, enjoying the breeze from the fan, and wearing a look that says "sorry...there's no more room". Looks like I'm on the sofa tonight then.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/4F3bwAwKqcEYmFmF8

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:29 pm
by Janey
I’ve never heard that area indicating food allergies, although I have heard flea allergies (i.e. bites), which is what we though was the cause of Tasha’s until she was still breaking out despite being treated monthly. I wouldn’t be too happy using Synulox long term tbh, I hope the more natural treatments work, best of luck she looks a real sweetie.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:10 pm
by Lilith
Aww, she looks so glossy and content - still enjoying life despite the lurgy, sweet girl and lucky to have found you I think :)

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:01 pm
by Ducky
Thanks Janey, I don't know much about Synulox but repeated antibiotic treatment (twice in as many months) can't be a good thing. I'm hoping the various bits that are arriving later in the week will keep any nasties at bay.

We had a good ol' scratching session whilst I was out today. What a mess. It's a bit frustrating. I was given some medical grade Manuka honey today to try. I've put a layer on the two worst patches (which are getting bigger) and put a small piece of tubigrip round her neck (to stop any chafing) and popped her collar on. She's very upset, and I am a bit too, but it has to be, for the time being at least. I presented her water bowl to her and she had a little drink, so I know she can, and she can also eat from her new Beco (whisker friendly) bowl.

Tomorrow's another day.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:21 am
by Janey
Well fingers crossed something works. The worse thing for Tasha was, she loves going out and we were having to keep her in with the collar on for a week at a time. You can end also end up spending a fortune on stuff. If all else fails I’d definitely ask the vet about Isaderm, it seems to be working for Tasha, just a tiny dab when and where she’s scratching and it’s stopping the breakouts. She scratched the skin above her eye about a month ago, for the first time this year, and it bled, so I put the cream on and it’s healed it up after about 3 applications.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:40 am
by Ducky
That sounds like powerful stuff. Is it a steroid cream? I presume it's prescription only then? I wonder if it might be worth having some of that in the fridge on standby. I'll give this Vetzyme powder and the Weleda Hypercal stuff a couple of weeks perhaps and then look at trying the harder stuff.

Ultimately, I'm only fostering this little lady to get her better so that she stands a better chance of being adopted. Whatever treatment or routine works for her now, will have to be continued in her new home. If that meant repeated medical intervention, her adoption prospects could be limited. So I won't offer out my spare room just yet!

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:22 pm
by Ducky
I think I've cracked it!

https://photos.app.goo.gl/sXhk2CrWvNpunALUA

KittyTube! Or 'distraction therapy'.

Now I've just got to find the autoplay button, else it'll be a long night.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:20 pm
by Kay
my Tiffany gets bald scabby patches above her eyes if she eats fish - she also got a large bald scabby patch following annual boosters, which had to be stopped - she is not limber enough to scratch these places, and in any case I take care not to let her have anything containing fish or fish oil

I would though when looking at a food she might be allergic to start with the things that would never form part of a cat's diet in the wild

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:54 pm
by Ducky
That's interesting. I've read that there's a link between facial and neck scratching and food allergies but never known of a case in practice. I must read more about this. If I could just eliminate food over environment, etc, we'd be a step further.

She's on a single protein (turkey), grain free (pea or something) diet and this is her third week of it. How soon does Tiffany react? Does she scratch constantly? And how long do you think it takes to exit her system? Just wondering how long I should give it before I switch.

I'm desperate for some cooler weather and I bet she is too. The heat can't be helping. I want to hack at my own shins with a carpet rake.

We're on night two of collar shame. Her wounds are sticky and matted with Manuka honey and she's solid sulk. God love her.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 10:01 am
by Kay
being a big fat lump Tiff was never able to scratch above her eyes easily, so the sore places never got to the stage of weeping - to be honest they were the price she paid for her love of tuna, and so I let her have some once a week anyway

these days she has become more intolerant of fish, and has very loose poo if she has any at all, so it is all off the menu

the main problem with many food allergies is that the problem food lurks in unlikely places - added dried egg and fish oil to a lot of dry foods, fish derivatives in nearly all Felix food regardless of named flavour, not to mention sugar added to a lot of supermarket foods which makes cats reluctant to eat the better stuff which doesn't contain it

I feed James Wellbeloved among other senior dry foods, but it does contain some things Lucy could be allergic to - there are less additives in some wet foods, mostly the ones produced outside the UK - I feed my two cats, and the two strays I look after outside, Bozita and Animonda Carne, which contain no nasties

most allergies, as far as my experience goes, manifest themselves very quickly, and disappear quickly too once the source is removed, but if Lucy keeps scratching her sore places what caused them in the first place may be irrelevant now - only once they are healed can you begin to search for the cause

which means keeping the collar on - for eating, have you tried raising up her food bowls so she can eat without bending her neck much? I stand food bowls on a wooden half-crate which is 10cm high, and use special sloping bowls which tips the food forward - you perhaps could try this by taping something on to the bowl

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:41 am
by Janey
Allergies can definitely be a pain to sort. As well as some form of summer allergy, e.g. flea bites or pollen etc, which is obvious due to the time of year her skin breaks out, my Tasha is definitely allergic to Webbox, because she’s sick immediately after eating them. I checked out the ingredients and surprisingly there’s very few ingredients listed, and 95% meat. I’d love to know exactly what it could be that affects her that’s in them though.

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:48 am
by Ducky
This is all really helpful, thank you.

The neck wound is looking cleaner and has a discernible 'edge' now, as though it's closing up. Whether that's the honey working, who knows. I'm hoping the powder and Hypercal stuff will arrive today so I can get started on it.

I read the ingredients on the JW food. There's certainly a few odd ingredients in it...

Turkey meal (27.5%), brown rice, turkey fat, white rice, maize gluten, poultry gravy, potato protein, tomato pomace (2.5%), potassium chloride, chicory pulp, chicory extract (0.25%), omega oil supplement, calcium carbonate, carrot, sodium chloride, cranberry extract (0.05%), yucca extract (0.02%)

I'll work on healing these wounds and in the meantime, start looking into what's out there food-wise, that is as simple as possible insofar as ingredients are concerned. I gather cats can even be allergic to chicken. So even the most basic boiled chicken diet may be the wrong avenue. What a minefield!

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:25 am
by fjm
I home cook for my cats and dogs, using meats from Durham Animal Foods. The frozen minces contain the right balance of muscle, offal and ground bone (although I have found my animals do better with a rather lower level of bone, so I use some of the meat only ones too. One big advantage is that I know exactly what I am feeding them - Sophy the papillon can't tolerate turkey, so anything "poultry" is a no-no. I buy chicken, beef, and occasionally salmon, rabbit, lamb and duck. It works out cheaper than a good quality wet food, and is not difficult to manage. The absolute favourite is the chicken mince raw, but I don't like leaving bowls of that out in warm weather!

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:37 pm
by Ducky
What lucky kitties FJM! And people think I spoil mine!! I'd love to cook them their dinners, but I struggle for time to cook my own some days! :D

It's something I will look into though.

Neck wound is looking cleaner and pink, not red, and a lot less messy. Temple wound makes her look like a walking wounded extra off Casualty. I had to snip away some of the fur around it because it was turning into a sticky, scabby mess. Still applying honey twice daily and cleaning the fur with weak saline solution and the wound with colloidal silver. At least until the other stuff arrives... which is taking it's sweet time. Collar on again today and tonight. The look on her face when I put it on would make the baby Jesus cry. What I wouldn't give to be able to make her understand.

I tried clipping her rear claw nails yesterday with a special gadget that my brother lent me. She struggled and I didn't want to hurt her or upset her but I might ask my brother for some help with it at the weekend. As an indoor cat they're quite sharp as you can imagine. It's a good job she doesn't know how to use them!

I was also thinking about finding her some sort of socks to wear over her back paws. Is that a crazy idea?

Re: Advice please... Lucy has an allergy - but to what??

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:46 pm
by fjm
Cooking really doesn't take much time - I defrost about 3 kilos of assorted meat overnight and simmer it for 30 minutes or so, after putting a few ounces in to cook with some fresh or frozen vegetables for the dogs (the cats get some of the vegetable gravy). The main thing is remembering to turn the pans off when they are done! In cold weather I just leave it all to cool; when it is as warm as it has been for the last few weeks I dunk the pans into a sink of cold water. Spoon into 500cc freezer containers, freeze, and take out one pack a day, which is enough for two cats and two toy dogs. Maximum 30 minutes effort a week!