1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

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Doseydosef
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1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:49 am

Im looking for some advice about my 1yr old female tabby cat.
Ive always had cats, my 2 gorgeous boys for 13 years, both neutered and never had any issues with them.
Although sadly my grey hunk died 3months ago age 12
My other big boy is still with me though.
My grey hunk was your typical indoor lap cat, where as my big boy is always out and definitely a top cat in the neighbourhood.
1 year ago we decided to get a kitten this time a female.
She was spayed at 6months old, she is just over a year now.
Both my boys took to her really well and had no problems settling her in.
Shes very active always out and about.
My big boy doesnt go out so much now as i think at 13yrs old he just enjoys a doze and a good feed.
I think he maybe missing his best buddy too
Up until about 2 weeks ago things were fine, but i noticed the odd cat coming into my back garden.
My big boy was straight out their seeing them off.
But this last week its been ridiculous. Im getting different cats in my garden all day long all looking for my female.
I woke up this morning to find 5 cats in my back garden!!!
With my female sat in the middle of them all.
They weren't fighting or miaowing but just all casually sitting their !!
My female didnt seem bothered by it at all, but my big boy was.
I dont know the sex of these cats so im just assuming their male and are after her.....but shes been spayed.
Ive had my big boy 13yrs and can honestly say ive never once seen another cat in my garden ever!!
I just dont understand why they are coming in.
Is it because before i had 2 males and now ive only got 1? Although my male that died was not a fighter.
Or are they attracted to her.
I love cats and to be honest if i just had her i wouldnt be bothered about them coming in, as they dont fight, they just all casually sit about like a gang.
But my big boy seems to be getting stressed out by it.
He is getting old now, and still has it in him to defend his territory every now and again if its the odd cat.
But he is to old to see off 5 at a time bless him.
I dont know what to do??
And i feel really sorry for my big boy, its his garden and suddenly its being taken over by every cat in the neighbourhood who all seem to want my female.
They dont come in if shes upstairs asleep but it seems the minute she goes out they all turn up!
Ive been chasing them off but as soon as i go in they come straight back.
My poor big boy seems quite depressed he only lost his buddy a few months ago and now his dealing with this.
The thing is my male cat that died never defended our garden or ever had a fight, it was always my big boy!!
Any advice or help would be appreciated please.
Manythanks

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Lilith » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:43 am

Hi and welcome :)

I agree, this is extremely rough on the resident lad!

This reminds me of a cat owned by a friend's father. She kept bringing home friends. She was neutered too; it wasn't sexual. It sounds as if, with your girl's encouragement, your garden has become neutral territory for her mates. Some cats just are social like this but, if they live with a cat who isn't, and wants to retain the garden as his personal territory, there are going to be difficulties.

The only thing I can think of, off the top of my head, is to let them out at different times, which is fiddly, but at least then the lad could have the garden to himself.

Good luck and I do hope the situation calms down soon ... it could be that the boy decides to accept it eventually, but it's rotten for him, especially with the loss of his friend. I've also heard that, when a cat dies, others in the neighbourhood move into its territory and I wonder if this is what's happening too. So it may well be a transition period but I agree you have to think of the boy.

Hopefully there will be other people along with more advice and experience, but hope this helps for now, all the best.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Mon Sep 17, 2018 4:07 pm

Thanks for your reply.
Well what an afternoon it has been! When i posted this this morning she was upstairs asleep.
She came down at 2pm and went straight outside, after 5 mins of her being out she start howling really loudly, i ran out to check on her and what i saw next shocked me!

She was spraying everywhere and basically putting her behind in the air ready to mate!!!!!!
Next thing you know i counted 10 cats all waiting for her, 4 of them bold enough to come in my garden another 3 waiting under my car out the front and 3 by my gate!!
I picked her up and brought her straight in. For the next hour she was constantly howling and basically getting in the position ready to mate!
I phoned the vets and explained the situation ive got to take her in tomorrow morning and keep her in now until then.
Im completely shocked this is happening.
Ive video recorded it on my phone to show the vet aswell.
Obviously she wasnt spayed properly!
Then 3 of the males started on my big boy so ive had to bring him in for now aswell.
Shocked i tell ya!
Its also good to know that people obviously dont neuter their cats either!
Wish i could post the videos on here for you to see!
Also can i just ask you another question please.
Ive got her insured but im very aware that vets charge for consultations scans and treatments.
Shes definitely come into heat so they haven't spayed her properly do you think they will make me pay for tomorrow and any treatment she needs? If they do would you refuse to pay it.
Im so angry!

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:07 pm

Well things arent getting much better!
Ive got a lock on my cat flap so she cant get out, but she just howls and howls and has been constantly scrapping at it to get out shes nearly broken it!
Ive also got 3 kids who haven't got a clue whats going on and our abit to young to be told how kittens are made!
Because of the layout of my house ive got no room to put her in except my bedroom.
So for now and tonight ive had to shut her in their! Shes got a litter tray in their and fresh food/water etc.
But shes not happy about it.....neither am i!
In the last 5 mins shes plucked up all my carpet by the door! And even though shes got a litter tray in their shes sprayed all over my bed and carpet.
Shes howling like a mad thing.....i could cry!
I cant let her out but i feel so terrible i know shes safer in their than outside but i feel awful for her.
Also i just dont understand how or why this has happened.
Im already gonna have to pay for a new carpet let alone treatment tomorrow.
My kids think shes in agony and keep crying for me to let her out,
My poor big boy looks in shock and hasnt got a clue whats going on!
I feel really stressed out about this.
My poor little girl. She was spayed at 6months that was 7 months ago.
And before anyone says she might have a urine infection....believe me she hasnt! She is definitely in heat. She is presenting her self for the world to see, no to be to rude but obviously where a male would put his penis in is massive and open!
She is ready to mate now!!!
Ive seen it for myself! How could this happen?

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Lilith » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:38 pm

Ohh noooo!

My commiserations! Something has clearly gone very wrong indeed; I've never ever heard of this happening, ever, and I've known a lot of cats.

I can't say if you're entitled to redress from your vet; I suppose that will depend on the vet and how they decide to treat her.

What went on before this 'explosion' sounded pretty benign, but this is really strange; I don't want to sound alarmist but it might be as well to consider neurological possibilities. On the other hand, I've seen this howling and urination behaviour in a non-sexual situation. I was having a (very quiet but intense) argument with my then husband and one of the cats freaked out like this; she was inconsolable for a short while, and I felt horribly guilty as she must have picked up on our vibes but thank heavens she calmed down and never did it again. (He is a very benign chap by the way; we're still good friends.)

Poor girl, I hope she calms down for you soon; I'd try to give her somewhere quiet and dark, and perhaps some gentle strokes and quiet talking to, and love her out of it a bit. Perhaps someone on here can shed more light on this - all the very very best and please let us know how you go on with her.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Ruth B » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:58 pm

I really feel for you in this situation, while i have never seen it I have heard of it happening. Apparently when a cat is spayed just as it is coming into heat all the organs are enlarged ready and it is possible for a small amount of tissue to be left behind, not enough to mean she could have kittens, but enough to release the hormones to make her body think she can. If you have ever watched any real operations on TV you will know that inside is just a mass of blood and different tissues which all look very similar, mistakes occur.

One other thing I will mention is that we did have an problem when I tried to introduce a new cat to my then resident two. One started spraying and then the others both started as well, nothing to do with not being spayed properly, but a dominance battle, however your case does sound different and I'm not sure it is relevant.

Hopefully your insurance company will be willing to fight this one for you, i would suggest calling them as soon as possible and letting them know what has happened. Hopefully it can be solved, but it might mean another operation to get the remainder out or hormone treatment to prevent it occurring in future. If nothing is done she will go through this every few months, I have never seen it, but from what I have heard I can't understand why anyone would keep an unneutered cat unless they were seriously planning on breeding them.

I will also add, don't write off you old lads ability to rule the roost even if he never seemed to. We used to have a Ragdoll cat that hadn't got an aggressive bone in him, but a lot of the instinct was there. He was naturally a big cat and very friendly, he thought everyone, cat or human, would be his friend, so when he saw another cat he would walk straight up to them, looking straight at them, full of confidence that nothing could go wrong. The other cats took this as the ultimate sign of pure confidence and reacted as it it meant that he never lost a fight and so most other cats backed down, if one did challenge him, as I said the instinct was still there and the fur fluffed up, being a Ragdoll, he went from large to huge, enough to make even the bravest challenger back off. I don't think he ever really understood what was happening, but he ruled the roost with out raising a paw.

Your lad might have had a similar position and with him now gone others have started to test the boundaries which is upsetting your remaining lad, and then with the problem the new female seems to have brought, stress levels of everyone have rocketed which also means everyone is playing off everyone else which just keeps making things worse. I know saying for everyone to calm down won't help, it doesnt' work like that, but it is just something to think about and hopefully you can concentrate on easing the situation rather than making it worse.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Jacks » Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:58 pm

Oh my word - I think there can be no doubt she was not properly spayed - it may not have been anyone's fault if she has some sort of atypical 'arrangement' - but she needs to get to that vet and be sorted out as soon as possible. There is no doubt she is in heat. I've known an unneutered male attack one of my spayed females, but she did nothing to encourage it and was traumatised by the attention... I suspect there was a female in heat somewhere in the vicinity...

Do let us know how your little girl is and when you manage to get things sorted. Don't let her out at the moment; even if she's lost her womb and it's a phantom heat, it's not a good idea to let her be subjected to this attention, and if they missed too much you could be looking at kittens or an ectopic pregnancy.

On another matter I agree that dominance is often more an attitude than just physical prowess. Our 9-cat roost is ruled by a middle-aged matriarch who has never had to win a fight but has all the right psychology and the passive aggressive moves to wear the others down. She has been joined in her rule by a 'King' - No 8, an alpha male who has the prowess but doesn't need to use it because his confidence and posturing alone had the others running in terror every time he swanned into the room... Even he now defers to her :lol:

All the best for your two!

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:08 pm

Thankyou all so much for the replies i really do appreciate it.
Its gonna be a long night and stressful few weeks ahead i think!
Ive had to open up the cat flap for my big boy as he wont stay in, he has always been an in and out cat all day long!
So shes grounded upstairs howling away, she will no doubt keep the kids awake all night aswell.
If she does need an operation im gonna have to keep her in for at least 2 weeks, how that is gonna happen with 3 kids running in and out, my 13yr old cat going in and out!
Im not looking forward to it.
Once my kids are settled im gonna bring her down and give her some cuddles, my partners just gone to get her some yummy treats and catnip hopefully that might take her mind off wanting to mate with every male in the neighbourhood.
Yes your also right about my big boy he is a tough cookie, he was shot by some idiot with a pellat gun age 2 and survived that, and he is a dominant cat in the area, but im completely shocked at how many unneutered male cats are down my road.
Shes definitely not going out, no way we will just have to rough it out.
She might get injured too with all them males!
It was like an alfred Hitchcock film earlier they were absolutely bloody everywhere, why anyone would want their female cat going through that is beyond me.
I have read up about the causes it could be, and your right about the missed tissue etc! I guess i will find out tomorrow and weather ive got to pay or not.
But i can definitely say for sure she is in a full heat cycle!
Oh my days!
Like a few of you said ive never seen or heard of this before, ive had cats for 13yrs.
Apart from my big boy being shot neither of my boys have ever needed a vet in 13yrs.
I guess i just worry about my big boy having to fend off all them males more so since i lost my grey hunk it broke my heart and it would be to much to bare if anything happened to my big boy.
Your also right about other cats wanting to take the territory since my grey hunk died, i thought that was what was going on as now his scent has been erased.
Might be abit of that too.
Im still in shock at the moment and upset for all of us.
But i really do appreciate all the comments and support it has made a miserable day a little bit bearable.
Will let you all now how it goes tomorrow
Manythanks

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Jacks » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:46 pm

What a business for you!

The suitors/Toms in your garden are not necessarily local or from down your road - in fact very few of them are likely to be from your local neighbourhood. Unneutered males will travel for miles after a female in heat - and not always be able to find their way home. They will end up in someone's garden (who already has cats) looking for food. Usually they are unchipped and it's not possible to find their original owners if you do end up trapping them. I've got three who turned up in my garden for that very reason... :shock: :roll: According to our local rescue and vet surgery unneutered males are nearly always unchipped. One of our local rescues will take and neuter any intact males as it saves so much anguish with injuries through fighting and unwanted kittens...

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by MarySkater » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:31 pm

Doseydosef wrote:If she does need an operation im gonna have to keep her in for at least 2 weeks, how that is gonna happen with 3 kids running in and out, my 13yr old cat going in and out!
When my female cat was spayed at 6 months, my vet said I could let her out after 4 days, although she didn't get her stitches out until 10 days. But I do have a secure garden, so she wasn't going to get into conflict with any visiting strangers. That may have helped.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:16 am

Just a quick update on how it went at the vets.
Basically the vet said that it could be some left over ovarian tissue and a smear might be beneficial to see if shes on heat???????
But she has to get intouch with the laboratory first before she goes ahead with it???????
If the lab ring her back today she can go into tomorrow but the test will only work if shes in heat????
Then once shes had that test she will need another one 7 days later........cost £280
If the test shows shes still producing hormones then they will go down the surgical route but i might have to wait til this happens again i.e goes into heat............cost of surgery £680
We questioned her about why we should pay as we already paid to get her spayed so this wouldn't happen and we were advised by the vet to spay her and she just grinned and said well these things happen.
Not even sure my insurance will pay for it as they only cover medical conditions arising after policy was taken out.
We had her spayed before we took the policy out so technically the issue was their before.
Im actually in pieces right now, the vet wont take responsibility, insurance company might not either!
I dont have the money to pay for it.
I know as an owner you take on that responsibility to afford and care for your pet and i did.
I spayed her as advised, got insurance?
Ive got her back at home howling again, 2 males already in my garden.
My bedroom stinks of cat urine and the carpet is ruined.
I basically paid for an operation so this wouldn't happen and now it could be weeks and weeks of this.
I cant shut her in my bedroom forever.
Im at a loss i truley am.
Gonna now ring up some other vet surgeries for a second opinion and my insurance company.
Im so tired as no sleep either last night

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by MarySkater » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:01 am

Find a Citizen's Advice Bureau and ask them about pursuing a claim through the Small Claims Court.

It might also be worth contacting the British Veterinary Association, describe the situation and ask what can be done about an unsatisfactory vet.
https://www.bva.co.uk/About-BVA/

Send a letter to your vet telling them that you'll take legal action. This was their error and it's their duty to put it right. I hope that the threat will be enough.

Point out to your vet that, through social media, you can spread the word about the date your cat was supposedly spayed, her current symptoms, and the behaviour of your neighbourhood cats. If you do have to put this into effect, be very careful to be accurate in all your statements.

The vets will probably never admit to a "fault." But if you lean on them and show you're ready to make trouble, I hope that "as a goodwill gesture," they will put things right.

Good luck.

PS - keep trying with your insurance company as well. I hope you've still got the documentation from when she was spayed. Therefore your vet told you she was neutered, and they lied. That must be actionable, and the insurance company will be in a better position than you to exert legal pressure.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by booktigger » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:40 pm

I'd definitely get a second opinion - unfortunately in 14 years of rescue work and hundreds of cats neutered, I've never come across this.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:05 pm

Thankyou so much for the advice maryskater.
I will now follow the link and get intouch with them.
Ive phoned my insurance company and they will cover her treatment for this for up to £2500. Im so relieved. I did spay her before the policy was taken out, but it is down on the insurance companys notes that this was done correctly and signed by the vet, i have all the documents aswell.
I have a contact who is local to my area i wish i had of called them sooner but didnt think this would happen, they are very knowledgeable and trusted person who has done alot of work with sancturys and has told me this is not the first time that vet practice have done this and they couldn't go into to much detail but, they know of people who have had this happen at the excact same practice.
They have given me a few contact numbers which could help and ive already booked her into the vet they highly recommended tomorrow for a second opinion and i will not be taking her back their again.
Lets hope we get my little lady sorted. Shes quitened down alot since yesterday and is looking very sorry for herself.
But at least for now the howling has stopped.
But i think for the vet to get accurate blood/smear results she will need to be in a full heat cycle so it still looks like we might not get her sorted yet, if that cycle has now finished. The vet should of done it this morning as she was still presenting and howling when we were their! But obviously they stalled that and now i know why. Im not happy with having to wait to go through this all again, but if it gets done properly i will have to, and hopefully the vet app tomorrow might shed some more light on this.
Also if in the next few days she has stopped and all the males have disappeared she might be able to go back out again, which is why she is feeling sorry for herself bless her.
But im just so relieved that at least she will now at some point get sorted out and im not worrying and crying over getting into debt over it.
I will be pursuing this and yes your right i will make sure its done properly and at least i have all the relevant paper work etc.
Thankyou for your support and advice i will keep you updated on her progress if thats ok and let you know how tomorrow goes. And yes booktigger i am the same as you. Im no expert but ive had cats for 13yrs although they were boys, but yes your right ive never ever heard of this! Nearly all websites say if you google, can a spayed cat come into heat say basically no, and i guess thats what ive always believed too. Im still in shock of it all.

Manythanks

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Ruth B » Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:16 pm

You have done all the right things, you had her spayed, you took out an insurance policy and now she has gone into heat, you could argue that as she hadn't gone into heat before you took out the policy you had no idea that this condition existed and therefore should be covered. As has been said, an insurance company is in a far better place to fight the case on your behalf than you are, they have the experts to hand.

It doesn't matter that 'these things happen', the vet didn't do the job properly and now they should be putting it right. You might also mention that if you do have to take them to court it will include redecorating the bedroom she has ruined due to their incompetence.

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by MarySkater » Tue Sep 18, 2018 3:45 pm

I'm glad the insurance company has agreed to deal with it. They will obviously be looking to get their money back from the vets, and they are better placed to fight than you are.

Just as an aside, I used to work in a hospital obstetrics & gynaecology department. It was not uncommon for a patient with several children to ask to be sterilised, by tying the tubes off. One particular doctor who did a lot of these operations had two of her patients come back in, pregnant... :shock:

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Doseydosef » Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:24 pm

Oh no!! Now that is definitely not good. Really makes you wonder really doesnt it.
Ive spent alot of time today doing some reasearch on whats happened to my lady and although yes its not common, its a rare situation, but ive been reading alot of stories of this happening, some not with nice outcomes either.
Thing is for me ive always had male cats and when i got her i thought a female might be nice. At one point i did contimplate maybe letting her have a litter as i am at cat lover and i would of liked to help her look after some kittens, but i did my research and read up about heat cycles and how difficult they can be etc and unwanted cats turning up and i knew it wouldn't be fair on my big boy etc etc etc. I spoke to quite a few cat organisations and the vet and was advised it was the right responsible thing to do, as their are to many kittens and you dont know who your selling them to, which is true i agree, and you also dont know who she will be mating with or what she could catch etc, also spaying her will make her calmer as she wont have heat cycles. And yes i do agree, i didnt want her out their being mounted by any tom cat, i didnt want my big boy to have to fend off any male who is attracted to her, and yes i didnt want her spraying and howling as so id been told it wasnt good for her and basically spaying her would make her a lovely calm cat! I not only listened to the advice, i took their advice and i paid them for it too.
Thing is im not sure if she has actually one of them males trying to mate her, as up until a few days ago she was out all night, i thought she was just out hunting mice, but who knows. Hopefully she hasnt, i know she wont get pregnant but theirs still a risk of her catching something, a decision i agreed on and didnt want
The thing is nowhere does it say when you spay your cat their might be a tiny even if 0.01% chance that even though they wont get pregnant they might still have heat cycles as their is a tiny risk of tissue being left behind etc.
As ive read up and now know this may happen.
Yes my little lady wont ever have a litter, but all the main reasons i did it for our happening now, her mental health and well being, my other boy too, the howling, the spraying and yes this might sound selfish, but im angry and not thinking straight, but the poor little lady is going through all of this getting herself ready to mate and have kitties, all these motherly hormones and their will be no little kittens. I feel quite sad for her.
I know she wont remember it, but i will.
It would just be nice to have been told that their could, probably not, but could be a chance of this happening.
I probably still would of got her spayed as i really think what these little lady kittys have to go through to get a litter is hard work, but shes going through it any way now and will get nothing out of it.
But at least i would of been aware, i just dont think its fair to tell people one thing without explaining everything.
But its happened and hopefully this will be sorted soon.
Shes actually been really quite and looking sad today and i thought it was over for her for abit, but about 15mins ago shes howling away again.
Im spoiling her though, i feel so sorry for her, im hoping tuna and abit of catnip and cuddles will settle her down.
Be interesting to see what happens from here, im just really hoping its gonna be easy to sort out as im feeling very emotional and drained, what these little fur babies do to us hey !

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Re: 1yr old spayed female attracting male cats!!!

Post by Jacks » Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:36 pm

So glad the insurance will pay and you've found a good vet - the attitude of your original vet is dreadful! Poor little lady - but she will be fine when she's been sorted. This should not have happened.

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