understanding early kidney disease question

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sera72
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understanding early kidney disease question

Post by sera72 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:50 am

Hello all,

Wonderful to stumble on this site and to learn all about our fur babies. Sorry, long post ahead ...

My darling fur baby, Ziggy was adopted 6 months ago (30th May 2019) and she just turned 15 years this month Nov. Her appetite was fine and she was on Applaws wet food for Seniors and Senior dry food. She hardly eats the dry she would only eat her wet without any fuss (chicken, tuna, salmon, duck, mackerel etc.) she would not mind anything as long as its wet canned food (85g x 3 tins) per day and we keep some dry food at night in case she gets hungry but she hardly touches it and we chuck it away in the morning.

I thought I would take her for a 6 month check-up as she was drinking quite a lot of water and urinating a lot . Upon taking a blood test it was confirmed she's on very early stages of kidney disease. The Vet recommended Hills prescription 2 tins of wet food & rest on dry food per day. Ziggy hates the dry food so we are giving her the wet food only. She's 12 lbs currently. The vet suggested only to give 2 tins per day (85gx2) and stop all other food she was taking previously. But Ziggy does not want to eat any dry prescription food and I feel she's really hungry all the time as there is less protein in the prescription wet food.

I did some research and many were recommending alternative renal food can be supplemented along with a renal prescription. I got few pouches of Royal Canin Cat Pouch in Gravy - Ageing +12 (85g) just to give it ago in substitute for the Hill's dry food and Ziggy loves this so much she wants more than a pouch. It does say its low in phosphorus and may help with kidney problems in cats. I am not sure whether to continue this combo Prescription+royal canin +12 pouches or not. P.s. I am aware of Royal Canin Renal pouches but I couldnt find it online or at our local vet in HK . Only the Royal Canin Cat Pouch in Gravy - Ageing +12 is currently available online hence the trial.

Also I ordered a bottle of Ultimate Feline Health Formula by Dr.Andrew Jones to give to help improve Ziggy's health. I am yet to receive it.

Would love to hear any thought on what is considered acceptable.

Thank you!

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Mollycat
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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by Mollycat » Mon Nov 25, 2019 5:27 pm

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Don't panic about a stage 1 renal diagnosis, especially at Ziggy's age showing no other symptoms than more water going through her system. My first cat was 8 when she was diagnosed, we gave her Hills dry (that's all there was back then) and all her usual treats and we had another 8 healthy years together with no other treatment.

By all means try different renal foods but the bottom line is the best food for Ziggy is what she will eat and enjoy. In the later stages she may go off her food and it may get harder to find something she will eat, but at this early stage when she doesn't know she is ill it's arguably more important to keep weight on her and enjoyment in life. Tanya's Pages https://www.felinecrf.org/ is packed with the best down to earth advice and answers to all the questions you didn't know you had, and we're here too of course. There is some debate about reducing protein for older cats especially with CKD as there is some evidence that cats' protein need actually increases in old age, even though it puts more strain on the kidneys. Vets are not experts in feline nutritional needs and they are usually tied to one manufacturer, most often Hills or Royal Canin, so won't recommend anything else. Hills do have the advantage of giving details nutritional information about all their special needs foods.

I recently had two cats on different prescription diets (which aren't actually prescription they are just not available in supermarkets) and everything can be ordered online, delivered or collect in store (eg [email protected]) - my personal favourite is PetDrugsOnline as they knock pounds off [email protected] prices and even more off vet prices. Most reputable decent renal support foods are available from them.

sera72
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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by sera72 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:46 am

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply and the link attached, which is very useful indeed. I shall be going through the link in the next few days as first glance it's quite a lot to read but I am sure I will have a general idea what diet plan I have to give for my precious Ziggy. Thank you once again and hope you have a wonderful week ahead.

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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by fjm » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:12 am

I am at a similar stage with Tilly-cat - 16 years old, early stage CKD, trying to manage with diet and struggling to find something she enjoys. I am in the UK which does make the choice wider, but it is still not easy - she has become very fussy! I went online and ordered a wide range of textures and flavours of renal foods, choosing the higher protein recipes. From that I discovered that she won't eat pate textured food, but quite likes gravy ones. My vet suggested upping the protein levels by adding a little chicken or fish - if I do she turns up her nose at it. Too much in the bowl and she licks off the gravy and leaves the rest... She has always been a tiny cat - around 3.5kilos/7.75lbs, and really cannot afford to lose any weight, so I now shove a tiny flat saucer with a mouse-sized portion of carefully mashed food under her nose several times a day. She condescends to eat it, then goes hunting for real mice, which I reckon just about keeps the protein levels right!

For Ziggy, I think I would try adding some cooked chicken to the canned food or feeding it separately - around 15-20% by weight, using thighs with the skin on rather than breast if you can. The slight additional phosphorus will not be a problem at this stage, and the extra protein and fat would help maintain his weight.

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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by sera72 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:55 am

Thank you Fjm for your response. It does give me some assurances that we can be flexible as well when attending to CKD cats. May I kindly ask if my Ziggy does not eat any dry food, how many pouches of 3 0z renal food should I be giving her at a max level? She's got a good appetite and I feel even after giving 1 pouch (3 0z) per meal, she still wants more at each meal time but I am not sure if I should be giving more. She eats morning-lunch-dinner but no dry food at all. She's 12lb and I am not sure if I increase the pouches to 4 if that will be too much? She loves her pouches and gulps it in a matter of minutes and asks for more. I did ask the Vet and was advised only to give 2 pouches of Renal and then Dry food the other times but I am giving 3 pouches to compensate for the dry Ziggy is not eating.

I hope Tilly will get used to the new food variety you are offering and not lose her weight :)

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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by Mollycat » Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:37 am

Vets do seem to like dry food. A little extra weight within reason shouldn't be an issue and it might be the novelty factor. My old cat years ago put on a pound in a week when we first gave her renal food and then stabilised there free-fed. Feeding guidelines are a guide, your own cat's metabolism and activity are individual and you know your cat better than your vet does.

Edit to add, same cat above used to put away a whole tine every day plus table treats plus whatever she found outdoors and weighed around 3-3.5kg, while 5kg Molly and Bobby did two pouches each and Molly is overweight. A tin is 400g, so 3.5kg Misha was eating more than 10kg worth of two cats way bigger than her. It's not just a minor difference in calorie needs.
Last edited by Mollycat on Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by fjm » Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:17 am

As Mollycat says cats vary in how much food they need. Depending on activity levels Ziggy probably needs 300-350 kcals a day to maintain her weight. The sachets are usually around 80-100kcals, so 3 - 4 would be about right, but the best way is to monitor her weight and muscle condition.

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Re: understanding early kidney disease question

Post by MarkB » Wed Dec 04, 2019 1:10 am

Hi, I haven't been on this site for ages, but have had several cats with kidney disease over the years. As far as dry goes, the most palatable one I tried the cats on was Happy Cat kidney. I used to buy it from Zooplus but Amazon have it for the same price now. Worth a try. I tried everything over the years. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Happy-Cat-Kidn ... B01HRHWXJO

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