Hi everyone!
I’ve been struggling with one of my cats bathroom habits and wanted to tap into your communal wisdom.
Context: My two cats, M and P are ~2 years old brothers who’ve been together their whole life. They moved in with me when they were ~10 weeks old. Initially, they used the same litterbox (first clay litter then scoopfree w/ crystals) without any accidents, but as they hit puberty (~6 months old), they started peeing/marking outside, and protest poops right outside the litter box when I lag in cleaning. After I got them neutered, the behavior got better. M has always been good, peeing and pooping in the boxes, however dirty it gets, but P couldn’t kick his habit. Over the past 18 months, his pooping right outside the litter box has become his norm, with occasional peeing on one of the carpets. I have expanded their litterbox capacities to alleviate the issue, and although they use all the litterboxes, expansion didn’t materially help. Now they have 2x scoopfree and 2x purina tidy cats and I've had a period where I also had the 5th box with clumping clay.
Recent trials: I have been working from home during Covid and wanted to use this time to propel a change in P’s behavior. I cleaned up after his poop religiously (bleach & urine removers), placed their feeder to the spots near the litterbox etc. but his behavior didn’t change. I finally had it with him and tried the confinement method. I put him along with food, water, toys and 2 litter boxes (scoopfree+tidy cats) in a 3 sq meter area for 3 days and expanded to the whole room for 4 days. During this week, he always used either of the two litterboxes. I got excited and let him back to the main floor and moved his litterboxes back but his first poop after his freedom was, again, on the hardwood floor…
One final thought: After this last incident, I noticed that the scoopfree he had with him during the confinement was used (scoopfree’s counter), but I believe by M. It could be that P is OK with using the litterboxes, as long as it is solely his. I don’t know how I can have M and P use different boxes though…
Any thoughts on how I can influence P to behave better?
Also, having read my fair share of these posts, few disclaimers: they are perfectly healthy, there hasn't been a major change in their lives since I started working from home >2 months ago, they are much loved, typically lying around bellies up inviting for a quick rub! Oh I also use Feliway multicat and original, which I don't think is doing anything.
Appreciate all the help!
Help with litterbox accidents in multicat home
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mistersmnp
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Mollycat
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Re: Help with litterbox accidents in multicat home
Hello and welcome! Seems P is aptly named!
My first instinct with this is a territorial issue, having started at puberty and just carried on, and with him being better when he gets sole use of a tray. Neutered cats do still have territories of course and even house cats often have zones of territory within the house. A lot of issues can be helped by watching carefully and adapting the home in view of the territory zones to help support the undercat.
Firstly a few questions. They get on well but does either of them do any of the following - roll provocatively in front of the other; sit in doorways looking all casual; eat first; have any areas where the other one looks a bit uncomfortable to be; is one always first to greet you when you come home; does one ever butt in or miaow or start playing noisily when the other is getting your attention? If they curl up to sleep or mutual groom together, which one instigates this and who is there first? Do they both look happy to stretch out and relax and groom himself absolutely anywhere in the house? Does one ever walk into a room or stretch and roll and the other gets up and moves to a different room or different part of the room?
As a side note you working from home is a change, but if this has been going on for 18 months it seems unlikely to be the problem.
My first instinct with this is a territorial issue, having started at puberty and just carried on, and with him being better when he gets sole use of a tray. Neutered cats do still have territories of course and even house cats often have zones of territory within the house. A lot of issues can be helped by watching carefully and adapting the home in view of the territory zones to help support the undercat.
Firstly a few questions. They get on well but does either of them do any of the following - roll provocatively in front of the other; sit in doorways looking all casual; eat first; have any areas where the other one looks a bit uncomfortable to be; is one always first to greet you when you come home; does one ever butt in or miaow or start playing noisily when the other is getting your attention? If they curl up to sleep or mutual groom together, which one instigates this and who is there first? Do they both look happy to stretch out and relax and groom himself absolutely anywhere in the house? Does one ever walk into a room or stretch and roll and the other gets up and moves to a different room or different part of the room?
As a side note you working from home is a change, but if this has been going on for 18 months it seems unlikely to be the problem.
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mistersmnp
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Re: Help with litterbox accidents in multicat home
Lol, haven't noticed the pun there 
his full name is Pishka
Great questions, I haven't watched out for many of those but let me describe a few behaviors that may help us determine which one is the undercat.
Mishka is a bit of a scaredy cat. When they first came, he was afraid of getting out of the box in the car ride, slow to leave my room to venture to the rest of the home, and to warm up to people. Over time as we bonded, he mellowed out and found his love for receiving affection. He often comes up to initiate the petting, rises on his hind legs and meows for attention. If I initiate the petting, he's most often cool with it and gets in the petting mood, e.g. lying down, opening his belly etc. He also sits with me on the couch and visits me in bed in the morning. He's otherwise scaredy, jumpy with sudden sounds, can't deal with simple stuff like trimming claws, or back hair, passive aggressively protesting by lying on his legs or sitting on his bottom when I try to manicure him (which many times leads to me giving up on the claws). He has long hair and is considerably fatter than his brother.
Pishka seems to not care much about things. He's not afraid of people, doesn't lose his cool when I trim his paw hair or claws. He is not as affectionate as Mishka though, e.g. he doesn't come up to ask for affection, when he visits me in my bedroom, he typically just looks from a distance then sits by the window etc. In the mornings, he'd be super excited to see me and would be vocal, and we meow at each other for a bit while I pet him. He likes a bit more "rough" petting, and back scratch and if I initiate petting when he's not interested, he simply walks away. One thing I noticed though, when he was in the "confinement" room, he was a lot more affectionate, greeting me at the door, and purring the whole time I'm there. I thought this was more about him being bored alone, but might be about status as well.
I believe only Pishka grooms Mishka. When I come home, both of them greet me at the door, but Mishka typically is the one that meows and asks for affection. When they play with each other, it seems that Pishka is a bit rougher on Mishka (Mishka at the very least makes more of a vocal fuss) and when I play with them, Pishka is a lot more agile/animated, and better playmate (e.g. after he catches stuff, he let's go soon after, while Mishka would try to run away with the toy). They often come in pairs, e.g. if I start petting one, the other will show up out of the blue -- one exception is when Mishka comes to me while I'm working or watching TV, I don't see Pishka around. They both hangout at the same chilling spots (e.g. either would lie on any of the bed/furniture), watch out from the front window. Pishka also goes around and checks the back window, which Mishka does not. I often see Mishka eat first -- I have autofeeder which drops the meals 5 times a day to a shared cup and Mishka would cartoonishly dart as he hears the sound, and skids on the hardwood floor, unable to stop. But Pishka then would come in and put his head through to the bowl. They don't have any aggression around the bowl. They both lie down with their bellies up all the time, and most often side by side. Their favorite spots to do this are the middle of the rug in the living room or center of kitchen.
Right about when the lockdown started, a friend of mine moved in with me into the guest bedroom and she has the tiniest also scardiest cat. Lulu almost never leaves that bedroom. Pishka can step in to that room and sit by the window to watch outside. Mishka typically makes a fuss with hisses and all, which often results with him having to wait outside in the hallway - though he does wait stretches of time right outside that door.
I had interpreted Pishka to be more confident and comfortable, but perhaps he is submissive and just let's go. And similarly, I had thought that Mishka is super insecure, afraid of anything, always begging for attention and is fat because he's similarly afraid that somehow he wouldn't get enough to eat, but it could also be that his insecurity is creating a drive "to be alpha." Also, although I had caught Pishka peeing a few times before neutering them, I actually don't have the proof that later peeing belongs to him. I have caught him pooping outside many times though, so that one I'm sure of I can live with him pooping right outside the box but peeing is my red line.
Do any of these help? If it is territorial aggression, what could I do to help them co-exist (with everything neatly in the litterboxes)? I can reintroduce Pishka and try to observe the behavior you mentioned that I hadn't paid attention to before - if that'd help.
Thank you!!
his full name is PishkaGreat questions, I haven't watched out for many of those but let me describe a few behaviors that may help us determine which one is the undercat.
Mishka is a bit of a scaredy cat. When they first came, he was afraid of getting out of the box in the car ride, slow to leave my room to venture to the rest of the home, and to warm up to people. Over time as we bonded, he mellowed out and found his love for receiving affection. He often comes up to initiate the petting, rises on his hind legs and meows for attention. If I initiate the petting, he's most often cool with it and gets in the petting mood, e.g. lying down, opening his belly etc. He also sits with me on the couch and visits me in bed in the morning. He's otherwise scaredy, jumpy with sudden sounds, can't deal with simple stuff like trimming claws, or back hair, passive aggressively protesting by lying on his legs or sitting on his bottom when I try to manicure him (which many times leads to me giving up on the claws). He has long hair and is considerably fatter than his brother.
Pishka seems to not care much about things. He's not afraid of people, doesn't lose his cool when I trim his paw hair or claws. He is not as affectionate as Mishka though, e.g. he doesn't come up to ask for affection, when he visits me in my bedroom, he typically just looks from a distance then sits by the window etc. In the mornings, he'd be super excited to see me and would be vocal, and we meow at each other for a bit while I pet him. He likes a bit more "rough" petting, and back scratch and if I initiate petting when he's not interested, he simply walks away. One thing I noticed though, when he was in the "confinement" room, he was a lot more affectionate, greeting me at the door, and purring the whole time I'm there. I thought this was more about him being bored alone, but might be about status as well.
I believe only Pishka grooms Mishka. When I come home, both of them greet me at the door, but Mishka typically is the one that meows and asks for affection. When they play with each other, it seems that Pishka is a bit rougher on Mishka (Mishka at the very least makes more of a vocal fuss) and when I play with them, Pishka is a lot more agile/animated, and better playmate (e.g. after he catches stuff, he let's go soon after, while Mishka would try to run away with the toy). They often come in pairs, e.g. if I start petting one, the other will show up out of the blue -- one exception is when Mishka comes to me while I'm working or watching TV, I don't see Pishka around. They both hangout at the same chilling spots (e.g. either would lie on any of the bed/furniture), watch out from the front window. Pishka also goes around and checks the back window, which Mishka does not. I often see Mishka eat first -- I have autofeeder which drops the meals 5 times a day to a shared cup and Mishka would cartoonishly dart as he hears the sound, and skids on the hardwood floor, unable to stop. But Pishka then would come in and put his head through to the bowl. They don't have any aggression around the bowl. They both lie down with their bellies up all the time, and most often side by side. Their favorite spots to do this are the middle of the rug in the living room or center of kitchen.
Right about when the lockdown started, a friend of mine moved in with me into the guest bedroom and she has the tiniest also scardiest cat. Lulu almost never leaves that bedroom. Pishka can step in to that room and sit by the window to watch outside. Mishka typically makes a fuss with hisses and all, which often results with him having to wait outside in the hallway - though he does wait stretches of time right outside that door.
I had interpreted Pishka to be more confident and comfortable, but perhaps he is submissive and just let's go. And similarly, I had thought that Mishka is super insecure, afraid of anything, always begging for attention and is fat because he's similarly afraid that somehow he wouldn't get enough to eat, but it could also be that his insecurity is creating a drive "to be alpha." Also, although I had caught Pishka peeing a few times before neutering them, I actually don't have the proof that later peeing belongs to him. I have caught him pooping outside many times though, so that one I'm sure of
I can live with him pooping right outside the box but peeing is my red line.Do any of these help? If it is territorial aggression, what could I do to help them co-exist (with everything neatly in the litterboxes)? I can reintroduce Pishka and try to observe the behavior you mentioned that I hadn't paid attention to before - if that'd help.
Thank you!!
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mistersmnp
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Re: Help with litterbox accidents in multicat home
I have an idea that I haven't tested. I believe I can adjust the gate between my 2 floors to selectively allow Pishka to venture downstairs (e.g. in a manner where Mishka won't fit ). I'm a little weary of this because I don't want a whole another floor that Pishka can pee around, but if having his own space would fix the behavior, it might work out.
Originally, the floors were split because my former roommate's partner was allergic to cats so we isolated their floor.
). I'm a little weary of this because I don't want a whole another floor that Pishka can pee around, but if having his own space would fix the behavior, it might work out. Originally, the floors were split because my former roommate's partner was allergic to cats so we isolated their floor.