Molly's teeth

[Mollycat]

Friends, you know how advice is something we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn't?

I've always used playtime to keep an eye on non-handling Molly's teeth as best I can, as well as giving treats that help me watch for any sign of soreness or avoiding chewing on one side, etc. All is normal, but today I finally managed to get a very poor picture that shows possibly two things.

First, the gum around her canine clearly needs a closer look from a vet, I'm still watching for signs of discomfort and there are none, which we know doesn't mean all is well, but I'm trying to balance as best I can while we can't go in with them.

Second, behind it, in the gap before the premolars start. I know there should be some lumpiness in the gum there, it's more obvious in dogs but it's a sticky (I call it octopus tentacles) area to help grip food while eating - but I'm not sure this is normal. I know I'm scared having lost Henry to a mouth tumour 3 years ago but on the other hand I also know I wouldn't entertain treating it so whether she had one or not, knowing will make no difference, but can anyone see enough to think this looks ok or not ok? Obviously she will have to see the vet for the inflamed gum around the canine, I hope once I can go in with her. She is 14 this year. Can anyone see anything there?

Screenshot 2021-01-02 124025.jpg (28.99 KiB) Viewed 462 times

Oh, she also has a dark spot under her chin in about the same spot underneath, it's not bald, not dark fur and not a scab or sore - I can see it's not discoloured and feel the rest, it's been there for over a year but wasn't always. Coincidence?

[Ruth B]

I wish I could help, but I really can't see it well enough to give an opinion, I can't really see my own cats teeth well enough when they are on my knee, but that is beside the point. Like you say, you already know the teeth need checking and a vet is the best one to give an opinion, so hopefully you can get it sorted. If it isn't giving her any problems it might be worth waiting until lockdown eases and hopefully you can be in the surgery with her, if it isn't giving her any problems then I wouldn't think it is an emergency.
I remember when Blue had problems he virtually stopped eating, he would approach the bowl of food like he was hungry then after a bite or two would turn away, where as Saturn had constant problems and several times we were told that he would need his teeth checking 'soon' but no vet made it seem urgent so we decided it could wait a while. Then one of his canines broke at gum level so the dental had to be done.The vet called while he was in surgery, all his incisors and pre molars had already been reabsorbed and what little was left of his molars need to come out. I was left feeling rather guilty that I hadn't had it done sooner, but he had no problem eating, was quite capable of hunting and killing the local mice and rats, and the only real thing I noticed was bad breath. In the end I don't think have all his teeth out except 3 canines has really made any difference to him, and I don't think it would have made any difference if it had been done 6 to 12 months earlier either. The canine that broke had been long for a couple of years, he did have a lopsided sabre tooth look to him when it was still there, and we had asked the vet about it, apparently they don't like to remove canines that aren't giving problems or aren't already loose, as the root goes right up into the muzzle and getting it out can be difficult and cause its own problems.
In the end a lot of things can cause inflammation around a tooth most of it fairly benign, and like me, you already have decided just how far you are willing to go with treatment should something really serious occur.

[Mollycat]

Wise words as always Ruth and thank you for sharing about Saturn, that kind of reassures me. Henry always had long fangs, I used to call him Goofy among many other names and one of his top ones got long - I understand why now, it's infection under the tooth pushing it down, and it's the same reason I had all my right upper molars filed down just so I could close on the left to eat.

Funnily enough this morning her gum doesn't look so swollen, it's something I think I'm likely to keep wondering about until I see something definite or go in which we want to anyway for updated bloods, once we can go in with her again.

Last night I had to pop to see XOH and 23 year old Purdy and found myself faced with an ingrown dew claw. It looked like a piece of macaroni. XOH is terrified to take her to the vets because he thinks they won't let him have her back. To be fair she looks a state, tatty fur, old sunken eyes, thin as anything - but she is a happy purring cat and although I'd like to take a comb to her I also recognise she is just old and it's ok to be old. There's nothing now we would treat her for, she couldn't take anaesthesia, so the claw distressed me because it needed dealing with. As she wasn't limping or in any way distressed, I first agreed to leave her be on the basis that XOH would let me know immediately if she showed any sign of distress, but then I put my big girl pants on and asked him for some clippers.

Purdy was cool. She let me test the clippers on her other thumb claw, so I took a deep breath and tried to clip through from the outer curve of the ingrown one ... no. That's where understanding structure helps, so I started to snip from the inside on the outermost part of the curve. She started to purr! I then trimmed away as much as I dared once the bulk of it was free, and left with strict instructions to call me at the slightest sign of trouble from it or the slightly wounded pad. So pleased with myself, I know the whole situation isn't ideal but I have to respect his fear for her. He was astounded to see the size of the thing he'd missed altogether, and to be fair it really wasn't obvious!

So after all this long story, I think I've got things into a slightly different perspective, and your comment really helped too.

[Ruth B]

Congratulations on dealing with the dew claw. One of my Mothers cats had one that grew round and into his paw, but the vet managed to deal with it without having to anesthetise him. When she mentioned it to me, was when I found out how bad Blues had got, not quite ingrowing, but a few more weeks and they would have been, ever since then I've been a lot more attentive to their claws and happy to take a pair of clippers to them if I think they need it.

Saturn's canine was odd, I think it just kept growing rather than being pushed out. When we first noticed it we asked the vet about it at his annual check up, thinking it might have to come out, but it was firmly in its socket, so she said to leave it 6 months and bring him back if it started to come loose. Two years later it was longer but still firm in the socket, then it was gone and they had to dig the root out. I would guess the absorptive legions that were causing the problem on the other teeth probably weakened it at gum level and eventually it snapped, but it still didn't seem to give him any problem. I am now seeing the remaining upper canine overhanging the lower lip at times, so I wonder if that will have to come out as well in the next few years. Apparently it is all due to a virus, possibly something left over from when he was a kitten, but in the end I don't care, I fell sorry that at 6 years old he has virtually no teeth, but he doesn't seem to feel sorry for himself, so I guess that is ok. He still hunts and most of the time still kills them, although straight after he had the dental work done we did get a few live mice, I think he had to work out a new killing bite technique.

[booktigger]

I'd get him to bathe it in saltwater, as an in growing dew claw can cause infection. I've had to deal with it a few times over the years, I'm rather keen on checking claws now

[Mollycat]

Yes booktigger agreed. It did cause what I would describe as a graze on the edge of the pad. Stupidly I couldn't even work out which end was live, hence cutting at the far side of the loop, but I'm still baffled that she has shown no sign of any limp or pain or even mithering at it. What I cut forms almost a full loop and I left a lot more than just a claws length there, it was quite bad, and yet not to her. I took a picture of it in my hand. All I can compare it to is my dad, in the last days before he died of massive internal infections, with awful open sores all over his legs and yet was smiling and insisting there was no pain anywhere and refusing all drugs except an oxygen tube under his nose. As in, it seems the natural endorphins of his dying body or the shutting down systems just meant he felt no pain.

I don't know about teeth Ruth I'm learning about them now really. I assumed after Henry died that it had been the tumour pushing his canine out? Maybe not then? They are so incredibly tough. We're seeing it with the dog now, and getting to know the signs he needs a paracetamol on top of his regular metacam and gabapentin. Shouldn't wish my life away but I am so impatient for his op next week.

[Ruth B]

Teeth can be pushed out, or as you know yourself, it can be that there is a problem in the bone that holds it in place and they can eventually fall out. The first cat we had developed a sabre tooth look as well, but when the vet checked it is was very loose in its socket, they took her into a back room, and then five minutes later brought her back without the tooth, it had been loose enough that they could just pull it out without sedating her. I guessed that was what they were hoping happened with Saturn;s, but it wasn't the case. Teeth are incredible things, they can put up with an incredible amount and have a degree of, not self healing, but a way of dealing with problems such as breakages. I have one premolar that has no tooth left above gum level, and I'm not ready to have root canal work done on it to have it crowned, so as the rood seems solid the dentist has built up a complete crown out of filling material for me and as long as it doesn't get infected it should be fine. The root hasn't died off like they used to think, but it has changed its composition and the nerve that runs up the root has died off at least close to the gum level, it might still be viable at the root tip, which is why it doesn't hurt.