Hello all, I want to thank you all for your kind words and support, and I also want to thank you for such lengthy replies. I really appreciate it. <3
I am going to address the things that have been mentioned one by one slowly, but a quick update on Penny: one of her other tests (biochemical profile, we did that with the blood panel but had to wait longer for results) came back from the vet clinic and the vet said in an email how her kidney enzymes are good but her liver enzymes are bit high and also her proteins are way higher. We also had a call with them on the phone today where they went a bit more in depth about the results but I can't remember the specifics exactly, but Penny is going back to the vet for the next 5 days to get IV fluids administered for 2 hours, and then we are gonna repeat her biochemical profile. I'm also gonna get a copy of her tests printed out as well.
fjm wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 7:27 am
I wonder if it is time to seek referral to a specialist - perhaps neurological as well as genitourinary. If the nerves governing her bladder control are damaged, which sounds probable from what you describe, that could explain her intermittent control and that in turn could help to explain the crystals and other issues. If the underlying cause is nerve damage and the accident was so long ago that it is unlikely that her nerve function will improve further at this stage, then it is down to getting the very best management routine in place that you can. I would be looking to review diet, fluids, drugs, supplements, frequency of manually helping her to void urine and faeces, etc with a specialist. Just increasing the amount of water she drinks by offering her the unsalted water chicken has been cooked in, or installing a fountain, might help a little with the crystals, although check with your vet first, of course.
I agree with this. I do want to see a neurologist for her condition and do non-invasive tests if possible, just to confirm if something is there or just to see how to handle her condition as best as possible when it comes to pain and such. I am also in the very slow process of talking with my current vet about supplements like pain meds or even cbd oil or anti depressants to help with her pain and/or stress levels etc., but the vet said that they would rather first focus on her current condition, work on that and then afterwards administer something for stress or pain. I hope that makes sense. When it comes to seeing a specialist about her other stuff- I will have to do bit of googling about that since there aren't proper veterinary hospitals in my country, only private vet clinics and several specialty clinic within the veterinary faculty/university. But me and my sister are also not opposed to travel outside of our town if necessary, as long as Penny gets 100% medical care she needs.
Ruth B wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:52 amAt the moment it does sound like you and your vet are just dealing with the problems when they occur, it might be better to ask to be referred to a specialist so you can look at the problem as a chronic one and have it treated as such rather than treating each episode individually. It might be that there is medication that Penny could be put on long term to help prevent the episodes happening or at least reduce their frequency.
I would honestly love this (to see a specialist). Because this is what we have been doing pretty much. And both me and my sister are getting a bit frustrated, because surely there is something more that can be done? Like, for example, making sure she gets pain medication or something else that would just help stress levels and mood management etc. It just feels like we are hitting a wall with her because by obvious standards (ie. have more than one litter, feed cats separately, keep them separate if one of them is stressed easily, have feliway, etc) we are doing everything. And we have mentioned this to the vet, but the vets haven't really referred us elsewhere, even when we asked about exploring further mentioning like "we don't care how much it costs, we just want to help our cat". So now I have taken myself to google and asking places on what to do or if anyone has had any experience with this because Penny does feel like such a special case. And when she is in her good moods, she is like the gentlest sweetest cat ever and she just radiates sunshine. So I would really hate seeing her even in any minor pain if it can be dealt with/prevented due to her nerves.
Ruth B wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:52 amI also want to ask, you mention she is a shy cat and the others can stress her out, does her attitude change at all after she has had an episode and then been on the pain medication for a while. If she is feeling uncomfortable it might make her not want to interact with them, if her attitude changes at the end of her medication run then it might mean she would be better off on some long term pain meds.
I can't say much because for a few months now, she's mostly been hanging out with my sister in her room, where she has been away from the other 2 cats. But on the occasion she wants to explore outside my sister's room, we do let her out but we also keep the other 2 cats at bay. But for most part, she seems content in my sister room and is mostly sleeping. But that could also be currently due to her current painful condition since it is back again.
When one cat (Pippin) attacks her, he only attacks her when he is hungry/wants food (and he does get food! that cat is a giant pain in the butt when it comes to food! he is a huge foodie where I can feed him and he eats everything and then an hour later if he hears me rummaging in the kitchen he comes running and twirling around my legs for more food
). If Penny isn't present (like she hasn't been since she's mostly in my sister's room), he will either go attack my other cat Soot, but Soot can hold her ground and fights him off, although he will also go and chew on my plants (he doesn't touch them otherwise and I don't have any toxic ones as far as I'm aware) because he knows he gets in trouble so it's him doing it for attention.
But anyway, when Penny is attacked by Pippin, she doesn't fight back, she's just there and sort of takes it so every time I would even see him just going for her, I would immediately intervene. But after that, she psychologically recovers/bounces back pretty fast and continues on normal. But when Soot attacks her, it's like psychological warfare. She struggles more afterwards in her demeanor and doesn't feel comfortable. You can see that because of Soot's attacks, she is insecure in herself when it comes to exploring/walking around the apartment. It's like Soot doesn't like her because she's female (Soot is also female, also all my cats have been spayed/neutered years ago now). But it's also weird, because Soot doesn't attack all the time, only some of the times? And there were rare occasions where Soot would even approach Penny normally and sniff her and walk away. And if Penny is sleeping already somewhere, and Soot comes along (not to attack her, just to also sleep on the bed somewhere), Penny will start hissing and act uncomfortable, and then slightly go back to normal. And they will both sleep together on the bed, even if they are less than a meter apart.
When it comes to pain meds, we haven't been given any for home use yet. She's only gotten them during vet visits as immediate relief from her condition and that is it.
Ruth B wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:52 amWhat style of litter tray and what litter are you using, if she is struggling to get in and out of a tray then a very shallow one might help her, and while a fan of clumping litter myself, it might be she would find a different type of litter easier to walk over. The final option might be something like puppy pads that she can just walk on and lie on to go, just knowing that there is somewhere she can go that isn't hard for her to get to might be enough to alleviate a little of her stress which can only be a good thing.
We do have 2 litter trays for her that are very shallow. And we have used puppy training pads before and she would use those. Sometimes instead of puppy pads we would also use old bathroom towels, just something soft for her and that absorbs. But we also switched one of her shallow trays to cat litter because there have been like 1-2 rare occurrences where she has gone into one other litters to pee? And she would also sometimes dig earth/dirt out from pots and then pee on that. So we thought..okay let's try with cat litter again, maybe should would prefer something more tactile as opposed to a puppy pad or a towel. We are currently using "Greenwoods Plant Fibre Natural Clumping Litter", but we might also try a clay litter, just to see which one she would prefer if any. And if not, back to puppy pads it is then.
Mollycat wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 8:25 am
A neurology opinion sounds like a good plan to me.
I know there are a million differences between us and cats because of our bipedal stance just for starters, but I do have nerve damage in the same area and I can tell you from experience a little inflammation caused by something as small as a false move can make you unable to pee and that is quite distressing when it happens. The nerves responsible for enabling elimination come from a different vertebral joint to the nerves controlling motor function in the legs. What can happen in road accidents is the tail can be trapped momentarily as the cat is running away, resulting in a sharp pull on the tail which can damage the spine and spinal cord.
With the expensive scans you would have to ask a neurologist about the options for care - put it bluntly, sometimes there is no sense in expensive diagnostic tests if they don't change the treatment options. On the other hand physio and even hydrotherapy can really help, so only the specialist can guide you.
It seems to me Penny is now a Special Needs Cat, if she needs that little bit of help eliminating, even if it's not all the time, but helping her twice a day even if she doesn't seem to need it could help keep her comfortable and reduce leaks.
As for crystals, do read up more about this and make up your own mind: a cat's urine is supposed to be quite concentrated and acidic to kill the bacteria that cause UTIs and whose waste products cause crystals. So too much fluid may not be the good thing it has always been assumed to be. Yes they need fluid intake but the issue is much more complex than pumping as much fluid into them as we possibly can. You say 6.5? Normal is 6.3 to 6.6 so if your vet is telling you 6.5 is wrong, get a new vet!
I'm really sorry to hear about your nerve damage, that is so hard and annoying to deal with. But I also want to thank you for sharing your experience, because yes, I also understand there is difference between cats and humans but I also believe if humans can feel the slightest of pain from whatever, then surely so can cats (and other animals/pets as well)! This just reaffirms my desire to take her to a neurologist and see what's up with her. I understand testing can also be a waste of time and money, but I love her so much, I feel like I at least should try. Or if anything, to come up for a proper treatment plan for her instead of going back and forth to the vet like so far.
And yes, the vet did tell us that her urine is completely normal actually! I think I'm just in such a frenzy from everything that I keep mentioning anything that might be relevant to the post lol. I'm mostly just concerned about the amount of leukocytes present in her urine because that definitely slightly feels abnormal, you know?
Anyway, thank you all so much again for your posts and I will keep you all updated. And also sorry for the long post myself. x)